Packers are releasing Mike Daniels

[PackFan2]

It was one of the possibilities, I didn't think they would release him acouple of days before camp. Rumors say Packers did try to trade him but got no (or any decent) offers. Next to go, Josh Jones.

 

[XPack]

If Martinez is asking for that kind of money it might be smart to let him walk away after the 2019 season.

What is smart in letting every performing player who demands a greater pay walk away? Blake is absolutely top class and has been a key part of the team and $8m is by no means extravagant.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Next to go, Josh Jones.

The Packers don't have the same quality depth at safety than on the defensive line. Therefore they might hold on to Josh Jones.

What is smart in letting every performing player who demands a greater pay walk away? Blake is absolutely top class and has been a key part of the team and $8m is by no means extravagant.

Gutekunst has to be smart regarding the salary cap, especially with the team having limited cap space moving forward. It might not be smart to overpay for an above average but not elite inside linebacker because of it.

 

[Mondio]

As it stands right now if it’s 8million per or let Martinez go, I’m letting him go with much hesitation.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I just took a look at average salaries for inside linebackers and have to admit that it will most likely take around $8 million a season to re-sign Martinez.

I'm still not sure being in favor of it though.

Second contract guys demand a premium if this offseason isn't proof enough.

If Lowry can land nearly $7 mil per year there's no reason to think Martinez won't land back with the Packers for at least $8 mil per per year, probably more. It will be interesting to see if he's extended soon with some of that Daniels savings.

There was no reason to act now on Daniels since his cap savings would not have converted to guaranteed money until opening day unless either (1) his medicals on the foot injury don't look good or (2) they have an immediate use for that savings.

It looks like Lowry is only taking up $1.5 mil of that savings, 1/4 of the $6 mil signing bonus.

Martinez is young, solid, reliable and predictable. That alone comes at a price, as Lowry illustrates. By "predictable", I mean you know who he is, what he can and can't do. The "can't" is cover downfield; he's a guy who plays well what is in front of him. Even that predictability has some value; you know exactly the kind of player needed to complement him.

 

[felix145]

Gutekunst has to be smart regarding the salary cap, especially with the team having limited cap space moving forward. It might not be smart to overpay for an above average but not elite inside linebacker because of it.

Agree. The ILB position is not that important as long as you are not Luke Kuechly or Bobby Wagner. It's the same with the RB position. $5 mil would be fine for me. Everything above.. let him go.

 

[Mondio]

I think Lowery is more valuable than Martinez. He's a big durable reliable and underrated guy. I think Martinez is a tad overrated. He's young, he's solidly solid I guess. I think if you take clark and lowery away, he's solidly barely average. At least to me. I know what is ratings or rankings are, but he just doesn't make me feel like he's a must have.

He's better than we do have, but to me he's not a 4th rounder that has played himself into a difference makers contract, he's a 4th rounder that I think we could likely find another one close to his skills fairly easily if we looked. With what's being built in front of him and behind him, I'd rather not overspend to keep him.

Of course he's young enough to make me change my mind, but as of now, he's decent enough, but he's no difference maker in my eyes. Even going back in recent history, he's better than Brad Jones, but not even an AJ Hawk. Maybe a tick better than Jake Ryan. I think Sam Barrington was better in his brief time starting.

I'd be ok in the 5 million range too, but 8-10? he better show me something more this year before I could get on board with that.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Agree. The ILB position is not that important as long as you are not Luke Kuechly or Bobby Wagner. It's the same with the RB position. $5 mil would be fine for me. Everything above.. let him go.

The appropriate salary aside, the idea that there are no meaningful gradations between $10 and $12 mil per year future HOF ILBs (who would be getting $17+ mil per year if they were signing second contracts this past offseason) and a $5 mil ILB makes little sense. Thinking the ILB position "is not that important" is a misunderstanding of how the game is played today.

The question is how much do you want to pay a guy who is not a good coverage downfield coverage backer. There are some good offenses today, a couple I can think of with future HOF QBs, who will attack ILBs all day if they cannot limit separation.

It is not the same with RBs. RBs are often not paid good second contracts, and many of the good-to-elite ones who get those second contracts prove to be not worth it, because they get whacked 300 times per season and wear down and get injured more often than at any other position. A RT, for example, can go through repeated leg injuries and still come back and play well. With rare exemptions, a RB will not and the next injury is not far in his futures.

 

[bigbubbatd]

People wanting Martinez at less than 7 or 8 million a year need to look at the going rate for ilb. He grades out as a good one. He will get paid. If you don't want to pay more than 5 million a year for ilb then you need to be ok with replacement level guys or guys on rookie deals

 

[gbgary]

People wanting Martinez at less than 7 or 8 million a year need to look at the going rate for ilb. He grades out as a good one. He will get paid. If you don't want to pay more than 5 million a year for ilb then you need to be ok with replacement level guys or guys on rookie deals

exactly. which means the teams gets worse. the middle of the D has been a weakness. letting daniels, and perhaps martinez later, go compounds that weakness. this is what you get when the cap gets thin.

 

[gbgary]

There is nothing to suggest he is one of the best guys on the defense let alone the team. On defense he is not as good as Clark, Martinez, Alexander, Amos, likely the Smiths, and probably isnt as good as Lowry and a few others.

Then you can add Rodgers, Adams, Bahk, Linsley, Jones, etc

nothing except his history. he's been a cornerstone player. now he's gone.

 

[tynimiller]

Since we are on the Martinez discussion...I'm torn. I love the guy and called he was gonna be a starter for us when we drafted him....BUT....I don't believe our salary cap will allow or make it smart (if you prefer that verbage) to resign him at 7-10 Million a year. He will garner that, and give props to him as he has earned it both by the numbers and the tape.

IF the Smiths and Gary do what many feel they can...if Amos and Savage pan out, and our CBs continue to grow into studs...I'm more comfortable searching for a rookie deal MLB after the 2019 season than I've probably been in quite a few years here as our defense surrounding them "should" make that role easier to come into.

 

[gbgary]

Not sure you're implying this but the 2019 season isn't the last shot for the Packers.

i am! i've said before that i believe this season is/will-be their best last-shot. after this year their cap situation gets worse and the potential loss of key guys coming up for new contracts, because of it, is problematic.

 

[HardRightEdge]

nothing except his history. he's been a cornerstone player. now he's gone.

"Been" not "is" is the operative term. I projected Daniels as a base D rotational player and versatile utility sub going forward with the new emphasis on length and athleticism at 3-tech. That base/utility role is Lowry's job now.

 

[PackAttack12]

you'd think a team taking one last shot would want all their best guys on board...and he clearly is still one of their best guys. he's a cap casualty plain and simple. it got too close for comfort.

In what world is this the 'last shot' for the Packers?

Gutekunst got out in front of this one. Pulled a page from the Patriots play book. Noticed age and deterioration, along with a big contract. That equates to it's time to move on.

The moves the Packers are making sets up for a 3-4 year window of opportunity beginning in 2020 to hopefully snag another Super Bowl.

Suggesting this is the last shot for the Packers completely contradicts the direction the team has been going since firing McCarthy.

 

[HardRightEdge]

i am! i've said before that i believe this season is/will-be their best last-shot. after this year their cap situation gets worse and the potential loss of key guys coming up for new contracts, because of it, is problematic.

That's premature. It depends on whether we can say at the conclusion of this season that Gutekunst is stacking drafts and whether this crop of FAs are playing up to their contracts.

Daniels' release adds $7.6 mil cap to the kitty. If Sternberger proves to be an adequate replacement for Graham, which is not a terribly high bar, Graham's release at the conclusion of this season will add another $8 mil in cap savings to the kitty for next season. Sternberger needs to be part of that "stack".

That's $16 mil in fresh cap space one might not have figured into the equation.

At this juncture, the guys I would consider core players entering UDFA after this season are:

• Clark: Obviously. It's easy to say "5th. year option". But the guys who end up playing on that (Perry or Randall in Cleveland this season, to take a couple of familiar examples) are guys who have something to prove to earn that second contract. If Clark keeps doing what he's doing, he's earned it. You don't stick a guy on that 5th. year if he's in your longer term plans. So, figure by this time next year Clark will be on a top DL long term deal. A big signing bonus can defer the bulk of the cap cost for a year or two.

• Martinez: Discussed extensively above. It will be interesting to see if the Packers make him wait to see if Burks proves up (another open question re: the draft "stack"). If Burks does not, then you have a "who else ya got" situation.

• Bulaga: Billy Turner is penciled in to replace Bulaga in 2020. That's one of the "is he worth it?" FA questions. Jenkins at LG is one of the "draft stack" questions. If these guys prove up then we're looking at finding a RG not paying or replacing Bulaga. I still think that could be Spriggs at RG, but so far they have not thrown in the towel on him as an OT (if they have not thrown in the towel altogether once the cheap rookie contract is up).

• Allison?: Some might consider him a core player. He might be the starting slot receiver. I don't see him as a core player. I'm not sure he can even survive running those routes in the danger zone. If one or more of the bunch of WRs added last season prove up as part of the "draft stack" then Allison will be expendable.

We've become conditioned to not getting much out of the draft over Thompsons last few years, resulting in the gradual erosion of the quality of the roster. It's possible Gutekunst's drafts don't pan out. In that case you are probably correct. But there is no current evidence by which we'd reach that conclution. On the other hand, if enough of the draftees pan out, that's the winning path in the NFL, making your own FAs expendable. There's little evidence for that either.

 

[GBkrzygrl]

Wow. Did not see that coming. I thought that he was very effective in his position. I'm not too crazy about them releasing him before day one, but I guess that helps him in a round about way. Gives him plenty of time to catch on with another team.

I am sorry to see him go and wish him all the best.

 

[HardRightEdge]

In what world is this the 'last shot' for the Packers?

Gutekunst got out in front of this one. Pulled a page from the Patriots play book. Noticed age and deterioration, along with a big contract. That equates to it's time to move on.

I wish he'd gone down this road a year earlier, specifically not signing Graham, which is not 20/20 hindsight by the way. I understand it though. Rodgers returning from injury, Gutekunst's first year on the job with Thompson lurking in the corner perhaps with Murphy's ear on some matters, tremendous pressure to get back in the playoffs.

But let's look forward. Rebuilding with second contract FAs (vs. the Graham-type declining stars that get a lot of play in these pages) and through the draft may or may not work. It comes down to what we will assess as the quality of Gutekunst's player selection at the conclusion of this season. But it is the only way, and with that we should say Gutekunst is on the right track and is reason for some optimism.

 

[brandon2348]

The CHAMPIONSHiP DEFENSE PIPE DREAM continues.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Did they think Mike Daniels was hurt or what they seen during the off season came to the conclusion he isnt what he once was and decided to release him at the star of TC to see if he can join another team.

Why now and not a week or a month or 4 months ago? One wonders if the tipping point was a current medical assessment of the foot injury that put him on IR at the end of last season. The potential severity of foot injuries are often underappriciated among fans.

Regardless, I see it as the right move.

 

[OldSchool101]

There’s been a push day 1 to get younger and faster on Gutes watch. This is just another notch in that direction.

My best wishes to Mike. Thank You for the great memories (and the use of your pic as my avatar for a couple years) we wish you the best Big Mike!

I believe this was also to lessen the cap hardship after signing 4 FA’s to large contracts. Got a feeling Za’Darius plays some upfront, Gary plays some Jack and Montravius brings it one more notch. Might go ahead and lock Kenny long term now?

 

[Mondio]

People wanting Martinez at less than 7 or 8 million a year need to look at the going rate for ilb. He grades out as a good one. He will get paid. If you don't want to pay more than 5 million a year for ilb then you need to be ok with replacement level guys or guys on rookie deals

I understand that. I think he's a nice enough player, but also limited and though he grades well, he's not what I could call an impactful player. I'd rather have impactful in the middle and paying 10 million than solid at 8. if that's my choice I'd rather take another swing at it for hundreds of thousands and keep building that D front and the secondary or offense with that money.

 

[XPack]

Gutekunst has to be smart regarding the salary cap, especially with the team having limited cap space moving forward. It might not be smart to overpay for an above average but not elite inside linebacker because of it.

Going by Mack thread...elite is not necessary as most here are happy with likes of Smith's and Gary. Now if we even start passing on above average one's...we'll just be going back to TT's Draft and Develop and we all know how that ended. After AR and Davante, we don't have capacity for another elite player. So likes of Blake are the best available to us..is how I see this.

 

[XPack]

IF the Smiths and Gary do what many feel they can...if Amos and Savage pan out, and our CBs continue to grow into studs...I'm more comfortable searching for a rookie deal MLB after the 2019 season than I've probably been in quite a few years here as our defense surrounding them "should" make that role easier to come into.

That's a lot of If's built into that equation...and once they develop into studs, we'll end up back with same situation we now have with Blake.

 

[HardRightEdge]

He's better than we do have, but to me he's not a 4th rounder that has played himself into a difference makers contract....,

Even going back in recent history, he's better than Brad Jones, but not even an AJ Hawk. Maybe a tick better than Jake Ryan. I think Sam Barrington was better in his brief time starting.

I'd be ok in the 5 million range too, but 8-10? he better show me something more this year before I could get on board with that.

A difference maker's contract is Mosley's 5 year / $85 mil / $43 mil fully guaranteed. Who knows what a Wagner or Kuechly or Willis would get if they were entering second contracts this past offseason. $20 mil/year?

This is not that.