Our Defensive Scheme and Execution is what is hurting GB

[Dantés]

This is not to say that the GB defense is great, or that we shouldn't expect more, BUT this is pretty noteworthy.

Packers RZ defense, per Ben Fennell...

• Scoring Efficiency: 75% (3rd)
• QB Rating: 65.9 (2nd)
• Completions: 45.9% (2nd)
• TD Percentage: 11.5% (1st)
• Interceptions: 4 (1st)

Green Bay has a lot of issues in run defense, and some players really get picked on in coverage. But they are arguably the best defense in the league when the field gets short and the stakes get high.

 

[Dantés]

More from Fennell-- of cornerbacks who have been targets 70+ times this season...

1. Stephon Gilmore, NE: 48.6% completion
2. Carlton Davis, TB: 50.7%
3. Tre White, BUF: 54.2%
4. Jaire Alexander, GB: 55.7%

 

[gbgary]

I think it depends on who falls. If there's a legit linebacker prospect there then sure, that seems relatively doubtful. The two sure thing linebackers were taken before pick 12 this year. Keep in mind that RT prospects tend to fall so that might be the better option there - a good prospect to play RT.

Look at the linebackers we've taken near the end of the first... Barnett and Perry. Plugs who have occupied roster spots for years without really providing a lot of upside. Really just sticking around because of their draft price.

Free agency may be the way to go to help solidify the middle. That could mean some restructuring of contracts or releasing veterans.

This is not to say that the GB defense is great, or that we shouldn't expect more, BUT this is pretty noteworthy.

Packers RZ defense, per Ben Fennell...

• Scoring Efficiency: 75% (3rd)
• QB Rating: 65.9 (2nd)
• Completions: 45.9% (2nd)
• TD Percentage: 11.5% (1st)
• Interceptions: 4 (1st)

Green Bay has a lot of issues in run defense, and some players really get picked on in coverage. But they are arguably the best defense in the league when the field gets short and the stakes get high.

nice. why wait until the RZ to turn things up? do it all the time, like early in the season, and put the ball in the O's hands more (not that they'll do anything with it lol). it couldn't hurt. maybe they'll get that rhythm they're always talking about going.

 

[Mondio]

probably has to to with the strength and skills of the players available. We don't have studs all over this field. Our middle layer is vulnerable. Our safeties have to cover for a few guys and a lot of area. King isn't susceptible to the double move as the field shrinks, etc.

 

[Dantés]

nice. why wait until the RZ to turn things up? do it all the time, like earl in the season, and put the ball in the O's hands more (not that they'll do anything with it lol). it couldn't hurt. maybe they'll get that rhythm they're always talking about going.

I think that Pettine sees liabilities in coverage in his personnel (King, the non-Amos safeties, any of the players at linebacker) and chooses to play it safe leading up to the red zone, attempting not to give up the huge play. Within the red zone, the field compresses and you don't have to worry about guys using speed to just blow by you.

 

[Mondio]

I think that Pettine sees liabilities in coverage in his personnel (King, the non-Amos safeties, any of the players at linebacker) and chooses to play it safe leading up to the red zone, attempting not to give up the huge play. Within the red zone, the field compresses and you don't have to worry about guys using speed to just blow by you.

I don't want to frighten you or anything, but is it possible we share a brain?

 

[Dantés]

I don't want to frighten you or anything, but is it possible we share a brain?

It's possible. I'm not often using it, so I suppose it would be available to you pretty often.

 

[Sanguine camper]

At this point, Petine has to scrap zone coverage. When the Packers go into zone, its a long drive and they can't get off the field. I know he's compensating for King's lack of coverage ability but maybe safety help would be a better option. I also think the pass rush is better in man to man coverage. It makes sense. Why knock yourself out when you know the qb can almost always complete a quick pass in the large holes in the zone.

 

[Dantés]

At this point, Petine has to scrap zone coverage. When the Packers go into zone, its a long drive and they can't get off the field. I know he's compensating for King's lack of coverage ability but maybe safety help would be a better option. I also think the pass rush is better in man to man coverage. It makes sense. Why knock yourself out when you know the qb can almost always complete a quick pass in the large holes in the zone.

His options at linebacker make consistent man coverage basically untenable.

 

[Sky King]

More insights from Leroy:

https://www.jsonline.com/videos/spo...reparing-final-push-into-playoffs/2598510001/

https://www.jsonline.com/videos/spo...hat-packers-secondary-doing-wrong/2598440001/

 

[TDF]

If that would be the issue and Pettine is as smart as you claim he would have gone back to playing basic defense several weeks ago.

Sometimes coaches tend to overlook the simple fix’s and are also hesitant to admit that their players aren’t picking up their system as quick as they should because it will reflect poor coaching

The Packers need to add talent at inside linebacker but should spend most of their resources on offense next offseason.

I agree that a bruiser/speedy middle LB that can cover has been overlooked for a decade, but wouldn’t you agree that if Martinez played on another team and became a free agent, Packer fans would be wetting themselves to get him! We see him play every week and see his weakness but his stats are eye catching

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Look at the linebackers we've taken near the end of the first... Barnett and Perry.

Perry wasn't an inside linebacker though.

I agree that a bruiser/speedy middle LB that can cover has been overlooked for a decade, but wouldn’t you agree that if Martinez played on another team and became a free agent, Packer fans would be wetting themselves to get him! We see him play every week and see his weakness but his stats are eye catching

Well, it's possible that fans of other NFL teams consider Martinez a stud because of the numbers he has put up. Taking a look at his tape he's not worth offering a lucrative contract though.

 

[gbgary]

probably has to to with the strength and skills of the players available. We don't have studs all over this field. Our middle layer is vulnerable. Our safeties have to cover for a few guys and a lot of area. King isn't susceptible to the double move as the field shrinks, etc.

they pressed early on with great success and the personnel doing the jobs really haven't changed. they're actually more experienced now and pretty much just as healthy. very frustrating. king just kills me. i've said before, considering his place in the draft, his injury history, and his pedestrian results as a whole...he's pretty much a bust. just a guy.

 

[Mondio]

they pressed early on with great success and the personnel doing the jobs really haven't changed. they're actually more experienced now and pretty much just as healthy. very frustrating. king just kills me. i've said before, considering his place in the draft, his injury history, and his pedestrian results as a whole...he's pretty much a bust. just a guy.

other teams have seen what they were doing and adapted maybe? Things have happened with other players we're not privy to that info? I've seen enough to know these guys know what they're doing. Trust me, it is frustrating. But I guy who can shut you down in the redzone isn't doing that by luck. he isn't some hack just calling plays that doesn't know defense.

We have some areas of youth and weakness that teams can exploit. They exploit them for yards usually, not points.

 

[Dantés]

The Packers defense has allowed 50% of 20+ yard passes to be completed against them. That's the worst rate in the NFL. That's why Pettine is playing so much cover three shell. He has to prevent the huge TD pass. And when the field shrinks, he's able to get more creative with his play calling and shut offenses down much more successfully.

It's a shame, given how much has been invested in the defense, but the there isn't a ton of personnel that's better than average on that side of the ball. Alexander, the Smith's, Clark, Amos, and Williams. Savage is young and could get there. Outside of that, the starters on defense are average or worse. And at the 2nd level of the defense, they're horrendous.

It's interesting that Gutekunst is responsible for every single good player on defense except Clark. That's a hopeful detail. Also notable is how much more "himself" Clark has looked since the bye.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

Perry wasn't an inside linebacker though.



Well, it's possible that fans of other NFL teams consider Martinez a stud because of the numbers he has put up. Taking a look at his tape he's not worth offering a lucrative contract though.

He wasn't technically a linebacker either. Since we're being technical.

 

[Dantés]

The Packers defense has allowed 50% of 20+ yard passes to be completed against them. That's the worst rate in the NFL. That's why Pettine is playing so much cover three shell. He has to prevent the huge TD pass. And when the field shrinks, he's able to get more creative with his play calling and shut offenses down much more successfully.

It's a shame, given how much has been invested in the defense, but the there isn't a ton of personnel that's better than average on that side of the ball. Alexander, the Smith's, Clark, Amos, and Williams. Savage is young and could get there. Outside of that, the starters on defense are average or worse. And at the 2nd level of the defense, they're horrendous.

It's interesting that Gutekunst is responsible for every single good player on defense except Clark. That's a hopeful detail. Also notable is how much more "himself" Clark has looked since the bye.

To this point:

Packers defense vs. passes 20+ yards downfield...

• QB Rating: 114.8 (29th)
• Completions: 22 (30th)
• Completion: 50% (32nd)

People asking for Pettine to just call man defense on a regularly basis are basically asking for the Packers to get shredded.

 

[Dantés]

The other aspect of this, from a more positive perspective, is that Pettine has not needed to blitz as much to create pressure. He's rushing four a lot, and his new edge duo has come up with over 20 sacks so far.

 

[rmontro]

Packers RZ defense, per Ben Fennell...

• Scoring Efficiency: 75% (3rd)
• QB Rating: 65.9 (2nd)
• Completions: 45.9% (2nd)
• TD Percentage: 11.5% (1st)
• Interceptions: 4 (1st)

That's pretty impressive. Given all their other defensive stats, you kind of have to wonder where all that is coming from.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

It's interesting that Gutekunst is responsible for every single good player on defense except Clark.

Does that mean you finally agree the Packers held on to Thompson for far too long???

 

[Dantés]

Does that mean you finally agree the Packers held on to Thompson for far too long???

I think I was pretty much in agreement that TT has lost it during that last phase of his tenure.

My main annoyance was that a GM who, once upon a time, was among the best in the league, was getting talked about in the most disrespectful terms imaginable.

 

[swhitset]

I think I was pretty much in agreement that TT has lost it during that last phase of his tenure.

My main annoyance was that a GM who, once upon a time, was among the best in the league, was getting talked about in the most disrespectful terms imaginable.

For that matter even if he had never been good (which he was) The disrespectful manner in which many people refer to players and coaches who are just doing the best they can is sad. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t replace people with better options when possible, it would be nice however to remember that they are human beings noit objects of disdain.

 

[gopkrs]

For that matter even if he had never been good (which he was) The disrespectful manner in which many people refer to players and coaches who are just doing the best they can is sad. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t replace people with better options when possible, it would be nice however to remember that they are human beings noit objects of disdain.

Agree! And not to mention the fact that they are athletes. You don't have to be "elite" to help your ballclub win games and on any given day you can stand up to the best of them and beat them. About coaches though... and refs...

 

[Sky King]

When a player blows a coverage, drops a pass, or misses a tackle some simple-minded fans carry on as though it was a deliberately personal affront against them -- front office and coaching errors, too. Unfortunately, that is when forumites get to bear witness to the noisy collision that occurs between the arrogance and the cruelty espoused by that hyper-opinionated ilk. Thankfully, the vast majority of posters consistently conduct themselves in a far more dignified manner.

Buggy Bill is 100% correct. The ignore setting is your friend, especially when it comes to the chronic offenders.

 

[Mondio]

But ignore can make the forum difficult to follow at times. I've gotten the "we already have a thread for that" a couple times because I couldn't see it or anything anyone else wrote on the subject as an ignored person was the OP. or you see a bunch of responses that don't make sense, but those can be skimmed over pretty quickly. It's the not seeing entire threads i find to be an issue at times.