Is it safe to say we will never address the ILB position?

[Mondio]

Do we need 2 kickers?

when was the last time we carried 2 kickers?

 

[McKnowledge]

when was the last time we carried 2 kickers?

https://247sports-com.cdn.ampprojec...Sam-Ficken-Green-Bay-Packers-sign--131228196/

 

[McKnowledge]

this guy?

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Idk. Unsure of his of his life off the field. Lol.

 

[OldSchool101]

this guy?

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Well. He did record a song “Colder weather”

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[McKnowledge]

Well. He did record a song “Colder weather”

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Can he provide hits on the field?

 

[Mondio]

https://247sports-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/247sports.com/nfl/green-bay-packers/Article/Sam-Ficken-Green-Bay-Packers-sign--131228196/Amp/?amp_js_v=a2&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQCCAE=#referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://247sports.com/nfl/green-bay-packers/Article/Sam-Ficken-Green-Bay-Packers-sign--131228196/

90 man rosters are nowhere near the 53. Come on. we've had 3 kickers on the 90 man roster before. BFD.

 

[speakhands]

when was the last time we carried 2 kickers?

That's not comparable. As per the OP, there has still never been a championship defense with only one capable off-ball linebacker, let alone only one on the roster.

 

[Mondio]

That's not comparable. As per the OP, there has still never been a championship defense with only one capable off-ball linebacker, let alone only one on the roster.

i'm not sure what you're getting at? somebody asked if we needed 2 kickers. My point was, there has been no time in the recent past that this team was cutting quality linebackers, or quality any position for that matter, so we could carry a 2nd kicker.

 

[AmishMafia]

when was the last time we carried 2 kickers?

Mike Sherman carried 2 kickers. One for kickoffs and 1 for FGs. He drafted one and felt compelled to keep him I guess.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

No...

This class had two really good players at inside linebacker and they went in the top 10.

Also, the Packers used a top 100 picks last year on a developmental WILL. Burks is highly athletic and came out needing some development, partially because Vanderbilt kept asking him to play different positions. Giving up on him after one season is stupid. You don't invest in developmental players and then decide that they're lost causes after one season.

Agreed, no matter what as a GM you gotta stick to your picks and allow them time to develop. However, I think Gute is trying to cover his losses by the two UDFA signings at the position just to see if he can get better for cheap.

Zach Brown is available. He would be a great stop-gap player if and when Oren Burks is ready. Brown is a tackling machine and good in coverage. He's getting up there, but he is still effective, and could come cheap.

Zach Brown made $3M in 2019 alone for the Redskins. He won't be cheap relatively speaking in regards to our cap situation. I can't see him signing for less that $2M on a one year deal. My best guess is probably about $2.25M.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

No...

This class had two really good players at inside linebacker and they went in the top 10.

Also, the Packers used a top 100 picks last year on a developmental WILL. Burks is highly athletic and came out needing some development, partially because Vanderbilt kept asking him to play different positions. Giving up on him after one season is stupid. You don't invest in developmental players and then decide that they're lost causes after one season.

The two Devin's were clearly the cream of the crop - The drop-off was steep after that.

The guy GB took in the seventh round, for example, graded out as the ninth-best at the position on at least one list:

http://www.draftcountdown.com/2019-nfl-draft/inside-linebacker-rankings/

Compare that with Dexter Williams, drafted ahead of Summers, who was graded as the 12th best at his position by the same site:

http://www.draftcountdown.com/2019-nfl-draft/running-back-rankings/

Packer sixth-round pick Ka'dar Hollman was ranked as the 34th best corner:

http://www.draftcountdown.com/2019-nfl-draft/cornerback-rankings/



So maybe getting the ninth best player at his position in the seventh round isn't so bad after all.....It's all relative.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I miss me some Nick Barnett.

I was never a big fan despite Barnett's splash plays and big tackle numbers. His play was undisciplined. Years after the fact I read one insider say he'd never shut up, sucking the air out of the position room.

I think he would be a better fit in today's game. He had that sideline-to-sideline speed and became a very good pass defender.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I'd say you're pretty correct, but a 4-3 WOLB and 3-4 WILB are more or less the same position.

They may be more or less the same kind of player but it is a different position in 4-3 base D. And in those days they played a whole lot more base than in today's game. Saying Hawk was an ILB draftee is simply not right.

 

[McKnowledge]

Zach Brown made $3M in 2019 alone for the Redskins. He won't be cheap relatively speaking in regards to our cap situation. I can't see him signing for less that $2M on a one year deal. My best guess is probably about $2.25M.

That's a fair point. However, I think he signed his last deal with the Redskins before the 2018 Draft. Heading into May, post Draft with OTA's around the corner, Zach Brown may find himself willing to accept a cheaper deal for a chance to win.

 

[Mondio]

They may be more or less the same kind of player but it is a different position in 4-3 base D. And in those days they played a whole lot more base than in today's game. Saying Hawk was an ILB draftee is simply not right.

And so is acting like Ted Thompson didn’t ever care enough to use significant draft position in a linebacker. Hawk is a hell of a lot more like our Ilb today than he ever was like Perry, Matthews, or Peppers.

 

[HardRightEdge]

And so is acting like Ted Thompson didn’t ever care enough to use significant draft position in a linebacker.

This line of discussion began with somebody saying Thompson didn't invest in ILBs. That was followed by somebody pointing out that Thompson drafted Hawk at #5. My observation was that Hawk was not drafted as an ILB and did not play the position until his 3rd. season and that he would not have even then if Barnett had not blown his ACL.

That's pretty simple. I don't know why you're trying to make my comments into something they are not.

Hawk is a hell of a lot more like our Ilb today than he ever was like Perry, Matthews, or Peppers.

There seems to be some confusion here. Hawk was drafted as an OLB in what was then a 4-3 D, an off the ball OLB. I'd have no clue why anybody would want to compare him to 3-4 edge rushers. I certainly didn't and wouldn't.

 

[Mondio]

Ohhhhh, that’s what it was about. Clearly Ted didn’t value linebackers

 

[Fat Dogs]

I was never a big fan despite Barnett's splash plays and big tackle numbers. His play was undisciplined. Years after the fact I read one insider say he'd never shut up, sucking the air out of the position room.

I think he would be a better fit in today's game. He had that sideline-to-sideline speed and became a very good pass defender.

I loved him. The Guy was solid and always around the ball. In fact, I still have his jersey.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I loved him. The Guy was solid and always around the ball. In fact, I still have his jersey.

Too often the run was going right and he was inexplicably going left and then tried to make it up with speed. For every splash play there was a WTF moment.

 

[OldSchool101]

Let’s just hope Darnell breaks the draft curse of “trading multiple picks to get 1” (Spriggs n Burks)

 

[HardRightEdge]

Ohhhhh, that’s what it was about. Clearly Ted didn’t value linebackers

Despite the explanations you still didn't get it. Thompson valued linebackers. He just didn't draft any inside linebackers very high in the draft until, of all people, Josh Jones. That was, and remains, the point. This should not be a matter subject to debate.

Otherwise we might as well say that Thompson drafted another ILB in the first round in the form of Clay Matthews. He played the position for a year plus. He wasn't much good at it, but the other guys on hand were worse. That's also how Hawk originally became an ILB.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Let’s just hope Darnell breaks the draft curse of “trading multiple picks to get 1” (Spriggs n Burks)

or "trading" TJ Watt for Kevin King and Vince Biegel

 

[Mondio]

Despite the explanations you still didn't get it. Thompson valued linebackers. He just didn't draft any inside linebackers very high in the draft until, of all people, Josh Jones. That was, and remains, the point. This should not be a matter subject to debate.

Otherwise we might as well say that Thompson drafted another ILB in the first round in the form of Clay Matthews. He played the position for a year plus. He wasn't much good at it, but the other guys on hand were worse. That's also how Hawk originally became an ILB.

Oh, I get it. You like to play with semantics and verbiage. You got me, Hawk wasn’t drafted as an ILB because at the time we played in a 4-3 not a 3-4, though his skill set and responsibilities were much more like what Martinez does than what Perry did.

Anyway. How many years did Hawk play inside? Vs his Outside linebacker days LOL. I forgot AJ played WLB'er for a season and a half and the last almost 8 years in the middle stood out more. You got me. I can see how that pertains to Clay Matthews moving for a season and a half part time because of injury. They had almost 8 seasons to replace Hawk as an ILB and didn't.

And clay Matthews was a defensive elephant end in college. Maybe Ted really didn’t like LBers as he drafted another DE in Nick Perry rather high. LOL

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Mike Sherman carried 2 kickers. One for kickoffs and 1 for FGs. He drafted one and felt compelled to keep him I guess.

Sherman made a lot of mistakes but he actually never drafted a kicker. As far as I can tell the Packers never kept two kickers on the roster under him either with Longwell kicking off as well.

 

[Dantés]

Despite the explanations you still didn't get it. Thompson valued linebackers. He just didn't draft any inside linebackers very high in the draft until, of all people, Josh Jones. That was, and remains, the point. This should not be a matter subject to debate.

Otherwise we might as well say that Thompson drafted another ILB in the first round in the form of Clay Matthews. He played the position for a year plus. He wasn't much good at it, but the other guys on hand were worse. That's also how Hawk originally became an ILB.

I understand that Hawk was originally drafted to be a 4-3 OLB, not a MLB, but the distinction between those roles is way smaller than the difference between 3-4 OLB and 3-4 ILB. The major difference, regardless of scheme, is between edge positions (34OLB/43DE) and off-ball positions (34ILB/43LB).

And in today's NFL, you're usually talking about the same positions regardless of base defense, because teams are so rarely in their actual base defenses. Essentially everyone plays a MIKE and a WILL in some variation of a 4-2-5 or 2-4-5.

The reality is probably that TT did not value the off-ball linebacker positions highly, whether you're talking about a MIKE or a WILL. This is assumed based on the fact that he spent two picks in the top 100 on the position in 13 years (both in 2006).