Hypothetical question on 2011 season

PackinMSP

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So we all know that 2014 the NFC Championship game was a choke job and I've always felt the crappy conservative play calling by MM after the Burnett interception was a huge reason why we lost. Aside from the botched kick and late bad coverage.

What do y'all think about the 2011 season? If not for crappy coaching and an unprepared team that got beat by the Giants

I feel like 2011 and definitely 2014 were super bowl years
 
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HardRightEdge

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15-1, two home games to get to the Super Bowl, you like the odds. It was certainly in the window of opportunity talent-wise.

But this was not great football team. "Just outscore 'em" makes a team especially vulnerable on "any given Sunday".

It came down to the character of the passing defense. The 10th. ranked 80.6 passer-rating-against is superficially good enough when coupled with a high powered offense, but when you scratch below the surface we can see the problem.

That 80.6 was as low as it was because of the insanely high 31 INTs. For perspective, you have to go back to the 2005 Bengals to find a team matching that number. At the same time, this defense was dead last in passing yards surrendered, 27th. yards per pass surrendered, 27th. in TDs surrendered and 19th. in completion percentage against. That defense set the all-time NFL record at the time for passing yards surrendered. If I recall correctly, they also set the record for +20 yard pass plays. These statistical extremes sync up with an eye test that says this secondary was a risk taking, rout jumping crew, vulnerable to exploitation. Losing Nick Collins might have been the difference; a glue factor that might have imposed better discipline.

So, what happens if an opposing QB has a hot hand and you don't get those 2 or 3 INTs? Eli Manning has always been a wildly erratic QB, looking like a world beater in one game or season and a bum the next. The fact he had a hot hand that day exposed the vulnerabilities in the secondary. Also, that Giant's defense was jelling in the last couple of games of the season, got in the playoffs as a 9-7 team, and then rolled to the SB win clicking on all cylinders. In the last 2 regular season games and the 4 playoff games, the Giants didn't give up more than 20 points.

Now, the Packers lost the turnover battle in that game 4-1, with 3 fumbles. If that doesn't happen the Packers just outscore 'em? Maybe? Probably?. But what happens the following week or the one after than with that vulnerable pass defense?

Green Bay in 2010, this Giants team, the Ravens the following year: hot handed QBs with good defenses, teams on a roll, coiming out the wild card. In 2011 the Packers ran into a buzz saw with a major exploitable weakenss.

Lets consider the current Rams team. Are they a good team? Sure. If they finish 15-1 does that make them a great team? No, it does not. The team you saw playing the struggling Packers is who they are. They score a lot; they're disciplined and resiliant but not great on defense. That Packer game was not some trap game or let down. The Rams have pass defense vulnerabilites if not quite as striking as that 2011 Packer secondary. If some "lesser" team with a good defense and a QB having a good day knocks them off would I be shocked? No. I suppose that Rams D could jell into something better it the could be a great team. But not as they stand now. And if they don't they will be vulnerable.
 
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Jerellh528

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It just sucks that we can’t seem to get a year since the last super bowl where the offense and defense both hold up. We’ve always had a fantastic offense but a dreadful defense. Seems like lately we’ve had a good enough defense but a subpar offense.
 

PackAttack12

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2011 is a perfect example of being over reliant upon Aaron Rodgers and the offense to deliver the goods and overcome (lets just be nice and call it) a below average defense.

2014 will always be the one that got away. That was the single greatest opportunity since 2010.
 
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2011 is a perfect example of being over reliant upon Aaron Rodgers and the offense to deliver the goods and overcome (lets just be nice and call it) a below average defense.

2014 will always be the one that got away. That was the single greatest opportunity since 2010.

Said that about 2014 on another thread. Said that game to this day makes me sick cause i truly believe we win the SB if we beat Seattle. Then was told that was wrong and that the Pats and Bellichek (spelling) would have out schemed us. That from a Packer fan.
 

LambeauLombardi

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Greg Jennings injury vs the Raiders that year killed any rhythm Rodgers previously had with him in the Giants game. I'd say they beat Kansas City the next weekend if Greg doesn't get injured in that Oakland game. I say they would have went for it all (going 16-0) therefore that week 17 Lions game all the starters would have played and they would have been much less rusty vs the Giants.

This team still hasn't got over 2014, especially the head coach.
 

rmontro

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Everyone always blames the defense for 2011, and maybe rightly so. But the offense let us down in that game against the Giants. We had the Giants at home, and scored 20 points, which was our lowest point total of the entire season.
 
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Everyone always blames the defense for 2011, and maybe rightly so. But the offense let us down in that game against the Giants. We had the Giants at home, and scored 20 points, which was our lowest point total of the entire season.

True, but the 2011 defense wasn't able to pick up the slack even once as the offense didn't produce that day. BTW they only scored 14 points in their inly regular season loss at Kansas City.
 
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PackinMSP

PackinMSP

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The defense relied on turnovers rather than good play

It was similar to the 03-04 defense that relied on a lot of turnovers from Sharper/McKenzie/Leroy

It's not a good way to play

But that was the year when AR had 45 touchdown passes in 15 games!

I put the onus on coaching due to how you can't just come out and put up 28 points quickly

Sure they were "rusty" due to a long time off but how could that offense just come out stone cold and "flat"?
 

PackAttack12

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Everyone always blames the defense for 2011, and maybe rightly so. But the offense let us down in that game against the Giants. We had the Giants at home, and scored 20 points, which was our lowest point total of the entire season.
The offense could have done more, but the Packers allowed the Giants to put up its highest point total of the season in that game. In a game where the Packers struggled offensively, the defense couldn't step up to bail them out.

It's been the story of the Green Bay Packers for quite a while.
 

mradtke66

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Said that about 2014 on another thread. Said that game to this day makes me sick cause i truly believe we win the SB if we beat Seattle. Then was told that was wrong and that the Pats and Bellichek (spelling) would have out schemed us. That from a Packer fan.

Packer fan was likely me.

I didn't like our chances against the Pats that year with a 1-legged Rodgers, based on how they played us in the regular season that year.
 

PikeBadger

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The 2011 team was an offensive juggernaut that pounced on opponents from the opening whistle and glided through the second half. There was no urgency on defense because for about 4 months it wasn’t needed to win. Turned out to be a train load of fools gold when the Chiefs exposed them in early December.
 

Heyjoe4

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The defense in 2011 was trashhhhhhhhhhh.
Very true. And that meant the strategy for EVERY playoff game had to be “just outscore em”. Well, the O didn’t show up in that first playoff game against the Giants, and without a solid D....... Well, it sent the Giants on the path to the SB.

There have been six SB games where the #1 Offense played the #1 Defense. The team with the #1 Defense won 5 of those 6 SBs. The lone exception was one of the Joe Montana-led 49ers teams.

Great offense will win lots of games and conference titles. Great defense will win championships, not always, but more often than not. I guess the baseball equivalent is that great pitching wins over great hitting. And even in the 3-point-crazy NBA, teams with the better defense usually win championships.

That doesn’t paint an optimistic picture for the Packers in 2018. That said, I like where the D is going, and it will be better next year. The offense will also be better with a younger, more creative and adaptable play caller. That person is NOT MM. The good news, maybe the only good news this year, is that MM is coaching himself out of GB. And GB will be able to pick whoever they want as HC. It will be the most coveted open HC position next year.
 

Heyjoe4

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The 2011 team was an offensive juggernaut that pounced on opponents from the opening whistle and glided through the second half. There was no urgency on defense because for about 4 months it wasn’t needed to win. Turned out to be a train load of fools gold when the Chiefs exposed them in early December.
It’s rare that a great offense, even a really great offense like the 2011 team, can take home the Lombardi trophy. There are no absolutes in the world, and people can disagree, but I’ll always go with a team with a great D when it’s money time. That 2011 D was lousy. The INTs masked overall lousy play.
 

Heyjoe4

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Greg Jennings injury vs the Raiders that year killed any rhythm Rodgers previously had with him in the Giants game. I'd say they beat Kansas City the next weekend if Greg doesn't get injured in that Oakland game. I say they would have went for it all (going 16-0) therefore that week 17 Lions game all the starters would have played and they would have been much less rusty vs the Giants.

This team still hasn't got over 2014, especially the head coach.
I can live with the 2011 failure. 2014 is a nightmare that just won’t go away. We all know the story so I won’t repeat it. I only felt marginally better when the Falcons blew an even bigger lead to the Pats is the SB a few years back.
 

rmontro

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True, but the 2011 defense wasn't able to pick up the slack even once as the offense didn't produce that day. BTW they only scored 14 points in their inly regular season loss at Kansas City.
Okay, I must have blocked that Kansas City game out of my mind.
We all know the 2011 defense was garbage, no one would argue otherwise.
My point was the defense stunk, as expected. But the offense didn't play up to their expected level, or even their average.
 

swhitset

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I would have been much happier to see the Falcons win that game.
I still remember my 12 year old son asking me “dad, why are they passing?” right before the double sacks that knocked them out of a game sealing field goal range. All I could say is .. “I have no idea”.
 
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My point was the defense stunk, as expected. But the offense didn't play up to their expected level, or even their average.

There's no doubt the offense struggled against the Giants but that's expected to happen at some point in the season. Unfortunately the defense wasn't good enough to help the team win at least a single game.

Therefore solely relying on outscoring opponents is a dangerous approach.
 

rmontro

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There's no doubt the offense struggled against the Giants but that's expected to happen at some point in the season. Unfortunately the defense wasn't good enough to help the team win at least a single game.
You're right the defense was useless, and you're right you can't expect the offense to never struggle.
That doesn't mean you expect the offense to struggle at the most important game of the year up until that point - especially when that offense is the strength of your team.
You're right you'd like to be able to count on the defense to win one for you, but that wasn't the 2011 team, unfortunately.

Besides, a month before we had hung 38 points on the Giants, in New York. You'd think we could do better than that at Lambeau. I still say the offense let us down.
 
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