Ha-Ha Clinton Dix Overrated?

[Oshkoshpackfan]

I don't think you can judge anyone because of what school they came from. Lacy came from Bama, he has done great his first year.....but look at the other two RB's that came out of Bama before Lacy, they are crap IMO. Trent richardson is lazy and lacks vision, and Mark Ingram can hardly handle getting it done for a 3rd down and 1 yard conversion. The where I came from system is a flawed one. Look at Donald driver..... late pick from Alcorn state..... if not for him, nobody would ever know Alcorn state college. To get technical, Cal is not some huge powerhouse, yet Arod played there and he is the best at what he does. Small schools shouldn't be overlooked because of who the play each year.... If a guy has skills, scouts see it and that's all that matters. I do think Dix is over rated, I watch a lot of southern ball and he didn't look like anything other than serviceable to me.

 

[HyponGrey]

Every bit as overrated as Mark Barron.

 

[Einstein McFly]

Is it really necessary to spellcheck? We're not writing published articles....


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Huh? Who cares about spelling? It's damn near impossible to read something without periods, which we all learn how to use in the second grade.

 

[FrankRizzo]

HAHA is overrated and overhyped.
Another Nick Saban defense guy who is that.

 

[thequick12]

Oh yeah he is over rated i really hope he does not end up a Packer.

 

[HyponGrey]

Oh yeah he is over rated i really hope he does not end up a Packer.

He is not of the same mind

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[thequick12]

Ok well he's cool for sporting a packers shirt, idk maybe he will be good. I just haven't seen him do anything highlight wise that really impressed me who knows maybe he has it and he will be a dynamic play maker in the league. But his 40 time of 4.58 scares me a bit packers need a safety in the Nick Collins mold. ie a former corner with great speed who can tackle and has ball skills. Terrence Brooks in 2nd, Tre Boston in 4th round though he may be a bit slow his 40 time is listed at 4.58 although he reportedly ran a 4.43 in 2012, Dontae Johnson or Marqueston Huff in 5th/6th round. The other 3 are 4.4 guys and all started out as corners.

 

[brandon2348]

Comparing college stats is a weird way to decide between players. This isn't baseball. They play against different teams, with different schemes and vastly different talent around them. Scouts have to look at what they do with all of that in context to decide, not just stats. Based on the vast majority of things I've read about this year's safeties, Dix is the best in coverage and angles and all sorts of valuable things that have nothing to do with stats.

Of course, look at how many GMs and scouts got the entire top and most of the first round of the 2008 draft wrong.

Still though, it seems like a lot of people who are wanting Pryor over Dix are people who like the idea of some big scary hitter in the middle who will "intimidate" guys, but that's not how things work nowadays. We need good, sure tacklers more than "big hitters". Roughing penalties will kill a defense.

Well blown coverage's and balls going right through our safeties hands for TD's have killed us way more then a few 15 yard penalties for a big hit that wakes everybody up and gives receivers "alligator arms." Obviously the rules have changed but it's football and there will always be a place or time in a game for a big hit. Sometimes it's about setting the tone and getting those diva receivers thinking.

As far as Dix it's a hype show and it has nothing to do with the fact that he cant hit hard. Everyone that argues with me about the safety position and what TT should do talks of a single high safety like what the team had with Nick Collins which would be great. Problem is Dix isn't that guy and not even close to the athlete Collins was. Nowhere near the explosiveness. Yeah he played at Bama and well coached but he is maxed out. Can anyone name one Bama DB that has done anything in recent years or reached the hype potential? Can anyone name an Alabama DB that did nothing for the Packers? I can. In fact he was a safety.

George Teague. At the end of the 1995 season, he was traded to the Atlanta Falcons for a conditional 7th round draft choice, after not producing according to his draft selection.

Dix wont be there at 21 anyways so I don't have to worry about TT drafting him. The only player I think worth trading up a couple spots for is CJ Mosley. Were better off drating a mid to late round safety or corner that has a high ceiling and developing him into this single high safety.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Ok well he's cool for sporting a packers shirt, idk maybe he will be good. I just haven't seen him do anything highlight wise that really impressed me who knows maybe he has it and he will be a dynamic play maker in the league. But his 40 time of 4.58 scares me a bit packers need a safety in the Nick Collins mold. ie a former corner with great speed who can tackle and has ball skills. Terrence Brooks in 2nd, Tre Boston in 4th round though he may be a bit slow his 40 time is listed at 4.58 although he reportedly ran a 4.43 in 2012, Dontae Johnson or Marqueston Huff in 5th/6th round. The other 3 are 4.4 guys and all started out as corners.

I would really appreciate if some of you would look at the tape and not only on combine numbers. For example, Byrd ran a 4.68 during his pro day.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

As far as Dix it's a hype show and it has nothing to do with the fact that he cant hit hard. Everyone that argues with me about the safety position and what TT should do talks of a single high safety like what the team had with Nick Collins which would be great. Problem is Dix isn't that guy and not even close to the athlete Collins was. Nowhere near the explosiveness. Yeah he played at Bama and well coached but he is maxed out.

Were better off drating a mid to late round safety or corner that has a high ceiling and developing him into this single high safety.

Clinton-Dix is the best cover free safety in the draft and IMO the best bet to turn into a guy capable of lining up as a single high safety. I´m fine with drafting a more athletic guy in the later rounds if Clinton-Dix is gone at #21, but you have to realize that it will take some years to develop such a guy into a player capable of filling that role.

 

[thequick12]

safeties always take a few years to develop. do you not remember Nick Collins and that other guy we shall no longer name. Collins was not very good his first few years he broke out in his fourth season. That other guy was good as a rookie but that was as a slot corner. His first few years at safety were full of bad angles and missed tackles. And I do look at the tape not just combine numbers. The tape I've seen of Dix as I said in an earlier post is not very impressive. He does not jump off the tape as a playmaker. Nor does he show the skills that would lead one to believe he will develop into one. The other guys I mentioned do if you watch their tape. And you can add Ward to that list of Brooks, Johnson, Huff, and Boston.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

safeties always take a few years to develop. do you not remember Nick Collins and that other guy we shall no longer name. Collins was not very good his first few years he broke out in his fourth season. That other guy was good as a rookie but that was as a slot corner. His first few years at safety were full of bad angles and missed tackles. And I do look at the tape not just combine numbers. The tape I've seen of Dix as I said in an earlier post is not very impressive. He does not jump off the tape as a playmaker. Nor does he show the skills that would lead one to believe he will develop into one. The other guys I mentioned do if you watch their tape. And you can add Ward to that list of Brooks, Johnson, Huff, and Boston.

I agree that free safeties take some time to be productive in the NFL, but playing in a pro-style defense in college will help to acclerate the process.

Ward is a SS safety and the Packers aren´t looking for one, wonder when some of you might finally get that. No idea who you´re talking about with Johnson. Would be totally fine with getting Brooks in the second or Huff in the later rounds.

 

[thequick12]

Dontae Johnson NC State has been reported the Packers have talked to him. And by the way Burnett will be the FS he was playing out of position last season because Jennings, who was limited to FS, won the starting job over McMillian who TT drafted to be the SS next to Burnett. So, we are looking for a SS though it hardly matters in the Capers scheme as the safeties should be interchangeable.

 

[Dylan Hoppe]

Dontae Johnson NC State has been reported the Packers have talked to him. And by the way Burnett will be the FS he was playing out of position last season because Jennings, who was limited to FS, won the starting job over McMillian who TT drafted to be the SS next to Burnett. So, we are looking for a SS though it hardly matters in the Capers scheme as the safeties should be interchangeable.

You're about to get smashed my hypon and captain. Very unpopular opinion my friend. An "interchangeable safety" is basically what we have in Burnett. It's what you call a safety who doesn't truly excel in either position. Some would say Burnett doesn't fit the role because he's a good SS but he's as close to the mold you speak of that we have. Jimmie ward is one of those players as well. They're right though, we'd be better off with someone who can really play single high and there are very few in the draft who can.


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[Deleted member 6794]

Dontae Johnson NC State has been reported the Packers have talked to him. And by the way Burnett will be the FS he was playing out of position last season because Jennings, who was limited to FS, won the starting job over McMillian who TT drafted to be the SS next to Burnett. So, we are looking for a SS though it hardly matters in the Capers scheme as the safeties should be interchangeable.

Johnson´s best fit in the NFL will be at CB.

I won´t comment on the other stuff you posted as it has been discussed over and over again here (http://www.packerforum.com/threads/safeties.51626/) and it´s obvious you don´t have any clue what you´re talking about.

 

[HyponGrey]

Ok well he's cool for sporting a packers shirt, idk maybe he will be good. I just haven't seen him do anything highlight wise that really impressed me who knows maybe he has it and he will be a dynamic play maker in the league. But his 40 time of 4.58 scares me a bit packers need a safety in the Nick Collins mold. ie a former corner with great speed who can tackle and has ball skills. Terrence Brooks in 2nd, Tre Boston in 4th round though he may be a bit slow his 40 time is listed at 4.58 although he reportedly ran a 4.43 in 2012, Dontae Johnson or Marqueston Huff in 5th/6th round. The other 3 are 4.4 guys and all started out as corners.

Nick Collins played Safety most of his college career. He only played a little CB his senior year. HaHa will be solid, but unspectacular IMO.

 

[thequick12]

I disagree an interchangeable safety is one that excels both in the box and in centerfield. Collins, Butler, and that other guy were all that guy as safeties in recent packers history. And clearly wimm didn't run a very fast 40, a bit slow to even be walking around without your helmet hey. Johnson can and is willing to play either corner or safety. I guess your opinion is he'd be a better corner than safety but that clearly depends on the system he ends up in.

 

[HyponGrey]

I disagree an interchangeable safety is one that excels both in the box and in centerfield. Collins, Butler, and that other guy were all that guy as safeties in recent packers history. And clearly wimm didn't run a very fast 40, a bit slow to even be walking around without your helmet hey. Johnson can and is willing to play either corner or safety. I guess your opinion is he'd be a better corner than safety but that clearly depends on the system he ends up in.

Seems Wimm ain't the only one here with a touch of butthurt.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I disagree an interchangeable safety is one that excels both in the box and in centerfield.

An interchangeable safety isn't talented enough to play free safety as the only safety high. Of course that guy will react to a run play and move up to the box to make plays there as well, but he won't line up there constantly.

On the other side asking a SS to cover deep routes means you don't trust your FS to do it on his own.

 

[thequick12]

I guess we disagree on the definition of the word interchangeable as it pertains to capers 34 defense. To me interchangeable means exactly that both safeties can play either the free or strong. Not that he is not good enough to play one or the other but that he is good enough to play both. So ideally Dom could line either one up in either spot adding another element for the opposing offense to prepare for. And so are you saying that Collins, Butler, and the other guy could only do one of those two things single high or in the box ? Because that's not what I saw them do as Packers. I saw them do both at a very high level for years. And that's what we need at safety especially if we are using a first round pick on one and even a second. In my mind Terrence Brooks in the second would be the best we could do in this draft as far as finding that player at a good value.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

To me interchangeable means exactly that both safeties can play either the free or strong.

You're right about the definition of the word.

Not that he is not good enough to play one or the other but that he is good enough to play both.

Having interchangeable safeties though means that none of them is good enough to be great at one of the positions.

 

[TJV]

IMO a truly "interchangeable safety" would excel at both positions. The problem with that is that guy is probably a pro bowler and finding one is difficult enough, finding two is damn near impossible. I don’t know who “the other guy” is but IMO both Collins and Butler qualify as that rare safety. But they’re few and far between. That’s why Capers’ talk about interchangeable safeties is odd to me.

Burnett, MD Jennings, McMillian, Banjo, Richardson, Bush, and Peprah. That’s a list of the players the Packers have lined up at safety since Collins’ career ending injury. None are great at either spot and last season none were close to being good. That’s why it’s easy to say “interchangeable” safeties when Capers says it means ‘not good at either spot’. But ideally, having two truly interchangeable safeties would be fantastic.

I don’t know which safeties in the draft are over-rated but I do know the Packers say they put a lot more stock on a player’s college career than combine numbers.

 

[HardRightEdge]

You're about to get smashed my hypon and captain. Very unpopular opinion my friend. An "interchangeable safety" is basically what we have in Burnett. It's what you call a safety who doesn't truly excel in either position. Some would say Burnett doesn't fit the role because he's a good SS but he's as close to the mold you speak of that we have. Jimmie ward is one of those players as well. They're right though, we'd be better off with someone who can really play single high and there are very few in the draft who can.


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Please add me to the list of those who see Burnett as a strong safety.

Blown deep coverage is the most acute problem at the safety positions. There's too much motioning and repositioning in the backfield still going on at the snap. Burnett has proven to be a decent tackler when he didn't have to horse around with the mental aspects of free safety. It adds up to a need for a quick-witted guy with good instincts for the deep ball.

 

[HardRightEdge]

IMO a truly "interchangeable safety" would excel at both positions. The problem with that is that guy is probably a pro bowler and finding one is difficult enough, finding two is damn near impossible. I don’t know who “the other guy” is but IMO both Collins and Butler qualify as that rare safety. But they’re few and far between. That’s why Capers’ talk about interchangeable safeties is odd to me.

Burnett, MD Jennings, McMillian, Banjo, Richardson, Bush, and Peprah. That’s a list of the players the Packers have lined up at safety since Collins’ career ending injury. None are great at either spot and last season none were close to being good. That’s why it’s easy to say “interchangeable” safeties when Capers says it means ‘not good at either spot’. But ideally, having two truly interchangeable safeties would be fantastic.

I don’t know which safeties in the draft are over-rated but I do know the Packers say they put a lot more stock on a player’s college career than combine numbers.

Right. "Wanting" and "preferring" are things apart from "getting" and "having". Capers "wanting" and "preferring" stems from his emphasis on disguises.

I recall as recently as prior to the 2011 or 2012 draft, I can't recall which, Capers commented that he wants 3-down players. Again, situational substitutions compromise the ability to disguise. The problem is that a roster loaded with 3-down players is difficult to construct; it requires a string of "A" grade drafts which has clearly not been the case.

So, we've been accumulating situational players and Capers more recent high-level take is that a defense needs about 3 play makers, the implication being they should be surrounded by competent role players. I don't think we'll hear much more about interchangeable safeties unless and until we're actually fortunate enough to land some.

 

[D3uc3]

Ok well he's cool for sporting a packers shirt, idk maybe he will be good. I just haven't seen him do anything highlight wise that really impressed me who knows maybe he has it and he will be a dynamic play maker in the league. But his 40 time of 4.58 scares me a bit packers need a safety in the Nick Collins mold. ie a former corner with great speed who can tackle and has ball skills. Terrence Brooks in 2nd, Tre Boston in 4th round though he may be a bit slow his 40 time is listed at 4.58 although he reportedly ran a 4.43 in 2012, Dontae Johnson or Marqueston Huff in 5th/6th round. The other 3 are 4.4 guys and all started out as corners.

Jimmie Ward the kids coverage is spectacular and he can really hit for his size and he also has excellent ball skills.