Assessing the Draft Class (2024)

[Krabs]

I actually agree with much of your post. That said on this part.. I think you are underestimating Hopper. No way in heck does Brian spend a Top 90 selection. for a LB to play ST only. He’s fully 100% saying he believes he’s a starter capable player.
Don’t listen to the draft pundits. Like Kalen King he’s going to have a specific role. The only reason you’ll see him on ST is like most players they have to earn their stripes.

Without knowing the draft placing or anything at all. Does the following sound like a ST player?

Hopper finished the 2022 season with 77 tackles with 13.5 being for a loss, 2.5 sacks, four pass deflections, an interception, and a forced fumble.[15] For his performance, Hopper was named second team All-SEC by the Associated Press.[16] Hopper was named preseason second-team all-SEC ahead of the 2023 season.[17] Hopper was also named a preseason third-team All-American by Athlon Sports.[18] Hopper was also named to the Butkus Award watch list, which is awarded to the nation's best linebacker.[19]

This is a TWO time 2nd-Team All SEC 2022,2023 athlete. That’s 17.5% TFL rate or 1 in every 6 tackles for a loss and all around disruptive Off the Ball LB

I would say it does not sound like a special teamer. In the same respect, what I've read, is that he is a thumper. He fills the gaps on running plays. He doesn't have great lateral movement. He has great down hill speed, which I believe is where the special teams talk comes from. I also have never seen him play. I would be thrilled if he turns out to be a starting caliber ILB. That would really round that position out. Keep in mind, I'm just a dude in Appleton. If I was actually good at this stuff I'd have a job in it.

 

[Poppa San]

If I was actually good at this stuff I'd have a job in it.

Since when is being good at something a requirement for being considered an expert?

 

[OldSchool101]

I would say it does not sound like a special teamer. In the same respect, what I've read, is that he is a thumper. He fills the gaps on running plays. He doesn't have great lateral movement. He has great down hill speed, which I believe is where the special teams talk comes from. I also have never seen him play. I would be thrilled if he turns out to be a starting caliber ILB. That would really round that position out. Keep in mind, I'm just a dude in Appleton. If I was actually good at this stuff I'd have a job in it.

Oh no I just meant i think you are going to be pleasantly surprised.
Ty’ron is obviously a very involved player though. I’m glad that I just didn’t pick him for his 30 visit on my board. I spent a little time reviewing his profile. I look at stats, competition level and watch a little film and if they miss time find out why. Ty’ron was pretty much that 5th consensus area, which for an Off Ball is nothing to be ashamed of. Marist Liufau was another one there also and I thought that strange because I found myself picking him in that RD4 area. Like you said the experts know much more than us. But maybe not always because both LB’s went top 87/91. That’s a far cry from later rd5 so the so called experts were 2 rounds off.

We passed on
Payton Wilson
Kamren Kinchens
Cedric Gray
Devontez Walker
Javon Foster
Mason Mccormick
TJ Tampa

all preferring to take Hopper. That said a lot to me I think GB knows much more than us put together. They spend time researching players throughly, unlike me. I think he was just outside our Top 50 board (#62/#71/#78 overall) something like that. He’s the LB version of Tucker Kraft draft value area who was split between Rd2-3 values.
We just needed two LB’s pretty badly rather than two TE’s is all.

 

[Thirteen Below]

It does seem to me that our GM and Coach both have a very good handle on their duties right now. Last year was as fun to watch as any since maybe 2014ish. And he is clearly being given what he needs in players (our GM). The have synchronicity it would seem.

It feels like the GM, scouts, and coaches are all on the same page, and that it's the right page. And that they're all coordinating and communicating, working together as a team to make sensible decisions as part of a master plan that they all understand. Everything they do just seems to fit together with everything else thay do.

We need time to gather more information over the summer and fall, but at this point, it at the very least seems to have been a very well-planned, organized, and managed draft. I think we can safely say that much. It's too soon to accurately evaluate the talent, but objectively I think it's fair to say that at #25, we drafted a highly rated offensive lineman who probably would have been gone 10 picks earlier many years.

One of our two most critical needs was linebacker, and in Round 2, I'd say we drafted the best linebacker of the year - and the rest of the league seems to agree, because every other team had at least one shot at him, and the next LB didn't go until almost a full round later.

The other of our two most urgent needs was safety, and later in the 2nd Round, we drafted one of the Top Two safeties - again, the league seems to agree he was at least Top Two because only one other was drafted higher. And in fact, many people feel Bullard was the better of the two.

We got players at every single position of immediate need, multiple players in most cases, and almost all of them are regarded as high-value picks at their slot. The early consensus among most draft watchers is that this may be the third consecutive excellent draft by Gutekunst.

I'm happy.

 

[Heyjoe4]

As usual, I trust this management team in totality. They continue imo, to bring in high caliber NFL level talent, high character and motivated young men for the coaches to work with. It's all on the coaching staff to get the best out of these guys.

Thanks for the succinct summary Pike. This will all, of course, play out in TC and the PS games. It certainly looks like a good draft given the state of the Packers when last we saw them. Gluten is bringing his youth movement to the D, and that seems to be a winning formula. So yeah, management has earned some trust and I really liked this draft.

Now if some people find the selections boring - well that's because the team was pretty good to begin with.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Oh no I just meant i think you are going to be pleasantly surprised.
Ty’ron is obviously a very involved player though. I’m glad that I just didn’t pick him for his 30 visit on my board. I spent a little time reviewing his profile. I look at stats, competition level and watch a little film and if they miss time find out why. Ty’ron was pretty much that 5th consensus area, which for an Off Ball is nothing to be ashamed of. Marist Liufau was another one there also and I thought that strange because I found myself picking him in that RD4 area. Like you said the experts know much more than us. But maybe not always because both LB’s went top 87/91. That’s a far cry from later rd5 so the so called experts were 2 rounds off.

We passed on
Payton Wilson
Kamren Kinchens
Cedric Gray
Devontez Walker
Javon Foster
Mason Mccormick
TJ Tampa

all preferring to take Hopper. That said a lot to me I think GB knows much more than us put together. They spend time researching players throughly, unlike me. I think he was just outside our Top 50 board (#62/#71/#78 overall) something like that. He’s the LB version of Tucker Kraft draft value area who was split between Rd2-3 values.
We just needed two LB’s pretty badly rather than two TE’s is all.

Comparing Hopper to the Kraft pick helps me better understand the choice. Certainly Gluten and his team know a lot more about these guys than we do.

I wasn't crazy about the Kraft pick and was happy to be wrong. So I'll look forward to seeing Hopper get some snaps. And you're right, the Packers were in the same position at LB this year as they were at TE last year. TE worked out well so here's to more success.

 

[Sanguine camper]

I think this draft class has some good picks but it has way too many players that were reaches. History has shown that reaches don't pan out very often. There's especially a huge opportunity cost of reaching in the top half of the draft. Despite the picks, the draft class left the o line vulnerable. Where does Morgan play? Is he a guard or a tackle? His agility is so poor that he skipped the agility drills. That suggests he's a guard. He did all the other drills so I doubt skipping agility had anything to with anything but hiding a weakness. If so, Tom stays at RT and a poor center who was a draft reach continues to start. Who's the swing tackle? Is Morgan vastly superior to Shawn Ryhan at RG? If he plays RG the upgrade for a first round pick may be minimal. Hopper and Williams were 6th round talents. Gute could've drafted better o line talent instead. Where do they even play? Monk and Glover were 7th round talents. To think they can realistically help out the o line as rookies is wishful thinking. Despite the 11 picks, Gute's frequent reaches in this draft have likely resulted in a minimal upgrade to the o line situation. One or two injuries and the season is undone because the depth isn't reliable using a slew of UDFA's, 7th round talents, and Royce Newman. Now that the dust has settled, Gute's Achilles heal of frequently reaching for players has left the 2024 season highly vulnerable to an o line disaster.

 

[PikeBadger]

Thanks for the succinct summary Pike. This will all, of course, play out in TC and the PS games. It certainly looks like a good draft given the state of the Packers when last we saw them. Gluten is bringing his youth movement to the D, and that seems to be a winning formula. So yeah, management has earned some trust and I really liked this draft.

Now if some people find the selections boring - well that's because the team was pretty good to begin with.

Boring schmoring. Winning is never boring imo.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Boring schmoring. Winning is never boring imo.

Indeed. And for the last thirty years (and counting), we've been bored to tears by so much winning. Favre got a SB win, Rodgers got a SB win, and Love is destined for a third. A great run continues.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I think this draft class has some good picks but it has way too many players that were reaches. History has shown that reaches don't pan out very often. There's especially a huge opportunity cost of reaching in the top half of the draft. Despite the picks, the draft class left the o line vulnerable. Where does Morgan play? Is he a guard or a tackle? His agility is so poor that he skipped the agility drills. That suggests he's a guard. He did all the other drills so I doubt skipping agility had anything to with anything but hiding a weakness. If so, Tom stays at RT and a poor center who was a draft reach continues to start. Who's the swing tackle? Is Morgan vastly superior to Shawn Ryhan at RG? If he plays RG the upgrade for a first round pick may be minimal. Hopper and Williams were 6th round talents. Gute could've drafted better o line talent instead. Where do they even play? Monk and Glover were 7th round talents. To think they can realistically help out the o line as rookies is wishful thinking. Despite the 11 picks, Gute's frequent reaches in this draft have likely resulted in a minimal upgrade to the o line situation. One or two injuries and the season is undone because the depth isn't reliable using a slew of UDFA's, 7th round talents, and Royce Newman. Now that the dust has settled, Gute's Achilles heal of frequently reaching for players has left the 2024 season highly vulnerable to an o line disaster.

Can't say I share your pessimism Sanguine. The team replaced depth lost on the O line. I think that the O line will be solid in 2024, if not spectacular. The ongoing problem is C, and that may have been addressed.

Aside from O line and WR, this wasn't a great draft class. I thought Gluten did a decent job with what was available. The only reach I see is Hopper, and there wasn't a serious attempt to address CB (7th round? C'mon). Overall I thought it was a good draft for an already good team. As always, time will tell.

 

[El Guapo]

Let's talk about CB for a moment. In the middle of the season, the law firm of Ballentine & Valentine did a pretty good job of covering top WRs. Should the be our top two corners? No. However, they showed that they have skills - and all of that was with marginal safeties. Now add Jaire and Stokes back into the top slots, with Ballentine & Valentine, and a rookie or two and I think that we have a pretty solid room. I expect that's what Packers management sees as well. IMO - safety was the highest priority followed by ILB because we are switching to a 4-3. We hit the main targets.

Some quotes from a 1/1/2024 article by Tom Silverstein about Ballentine & Valentine: https://www.packersnews.com/story/s...ballentine-a-winning-combination/72060734007/

The pair have started six games together and the Packers are 4-2 in those games. The starting quarterbacks they faced in the victories were Justin Herbert, Jared Goff, Patrick Mahomes and Hall. The yards passing allowed in the six games were, in order, 126, 260, 332, 210, 158 and 113.

“The big two wins we had over the Chiefs and Lions, they were in that game,” linebacker Quay Walker said. “They haven’t played a whole lot of ball, but they’ve stepped up this whole year. I don’t think people give them the credit that they deserve.

“They’ve been playing outstanding.”

 

[Sanguine camper]

Can't say I share your pessimism Sanguine. The team replaced depth lost on the O line. I think that the O line will be solid in 2024, if not spectacular. The ongoing problem is C, and that may have been addressed.

Aside from O line and WR, this wasn't a great draft class. I thought Gluten did a decent job with what was available. The only reach I see is Hopper, and there wasn't a serious attempt to address CB (7th round? C'mon). Overall I thought it was a good draft for an already good team. As always, time will tell.

How do they fix the center situation? There are two options. Tom moves over and leaves a hole at RT. Perhaps Morgan can play RT but that's a big assumption since he's more likely to play guard in the NFL given his agility limitations. Perhaps Morgan can play center but he would need to learn an entirely new position that comes with a substantial learning curve. If Morgan supplants Ryhan at RG Perhaps he can battle Myers for the starting center position. Assuming Tom moves to center and Morgan can play RT, that would leave the Packers with Myers, Newman and Monk (projected 7th rounder) as C/G depth. Not ideal. Backup tackles would be 4 UDFA players who have never played a down in Jones, Tenuta, Telfort and Jennings. That makes Tom the likely swing tackle if any starters get hurt which in a 17 game season is likely. The Packers can survive one injury on the o line. If 2 or more go down I don't think this draft did enough to bolster the depth to counteract that situation.

 

[Krabs]

Since when is being good at something a requirement for being considered an expert?

Well played.

 

[Krabs]

How do they fix the center situation? There are two options. Tom moves over and leaves a hole at RT. Perhaps Morgan can play RT but that's a big assumption since he's more likely to play guard in the NFL given his agility limitations. Perhaps Morgan can play center but he would need to learn an entirely new position that comes with a substantial learning curve. If Morgan supplants Ryhan at RG Perhaps he can battle Myers for the starting center position. Assuming Tom moves to center and Morgan can play RT, that would leave the Packers with Myers, Newman and Monk (projected 7th rounder) as C/G depth. Not ideal. Backup tackles would be 4 UDFA players who have never played a down in Jones, Tenuta, Telfort and Jennings. That makes Tom the likely swing tackle if any starters get hurt which in a 17 game season is likely. The Packers can survive one injury on the o line. If 2 or more go down I don't think this draft did enough to bolster the depth to counteract that situation.

I really like the Monk pick. I think it was another classic steal oline pick that the Packers seem to pull off year in and year out. Myers played a lot better down the stretch. Out of the 32 starting centers PFF ranked him 18th. Sure, there's better, but he's an average center in the league. We could have used an upgrade, but not all is lost with Myers at center. Not that I want to count on undrafted free agents, but they also singed Donovan Jennings out of USF. They actually gave him a decent signing bonus and guaranteed money because they believe he can make the team. There has been talk about Tom moving to center. My wager is the stay put with Myers and leave Tom there. I also have not heard any talk about other players moving to center except Tom. Morgan will be at tackle and Monk with go guard.

Time will tell. I don't mind what they did.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I really like the Monk pick. I think it was another classic steal oline pick that the Packers seem to pull off year in and year out. Myers played a lot better down the stretch. Out of the 32 starting centers PFF ranked him 18th. Sure, there's better, but he's an average center in the league. We could have used an upgrade, but not all is lost with Myers at center. Not that I want to count on undrafted free agents, but they also singed Donovan Jennings out of USF. They actually gave him a decent signing bonus and guaranteed money because they believe he can make the team. There has been talk about Tom moving to center. My wager is the stay put with Myers and leave Tom there. I also have not heard any talk about other players moving to center except Tom. Morgan will be at tackle and Monk with go guard.

Time will tell. I don't mind what they did.

Thanks for the perspective Krabs. Tom's not moving to C. Myers will play well enough. The O line will be fine this year.

And I agree, Monk was a solid pick.

 

[Sanguine camper]

Thanks for the perspective Krabs. Tom's not moving to C. Myers will play well enough. The O line will be fine this year.

And I agree, Monk was a solid pick.

I fail to have your sense of optimism on the Monk pick. Most of the time when a GM reaches for a pick and Monk was a projected late 7th round pick, it doesn't work out. The odds are against the Monk pick working out. Maybe he'll be good enough to be a serviceable backup. The Packets will be fine at o line if everyone stays healthy. It's the depth that concerns me and capacity for the inevitable injuries to derail the unit.

 

[Thirteen Below]

Myers played a lot better down the stretch. Out of the 32 starting centers PFF ranked him 18th. Sure, there's better, but he's an average center in the league. We could have used an upgrade, but not all is lost with Myers at center.

I've said that a number of times, too, but most people seem really locked in on how poorly he played at times earlier in the year. Truth is, there were quite a lot of weak spots on the line at some point or another early in the` season, and I didn't see where Myers was significantly worse than others. By the end of the year, Myers was very strong on pass defense - I read that on 54 postseason passing snaps, he gave up zero sacks, zero hurries.

It's his run blocking that worries me. Too many times, when he gets out into space, he doesn't seem to know what to do next. To be honest, sometimes it looks like he's afraid to pick a man until he knows for sure whether Ryan is going to miss his block, so maybe better guard play would make a difference. But he finished the year strong, and I think he gets a solid chance to win the job convincingly this summer. He'll have all the competition he needs to motivate him.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I fail to have your sense of optimism on the Monk pick. Most of the time when a GM reaches for a pick and Monk was a projected late 7th round pick, it doesn't work out. The odds are against the Monk pick working out. Maybe he'll be good enough to be a serviceable backup. The Packets will be fine at o line if everyone stays healthy. It's the depth that concerns me and capacity for the inevitable injuries to derail the unit.

I see your point. And really I'm trusting Gluten on Monk, so who knows? For some reason, probably the coaching, GB has almost always fielded a solid O line, even in years with injuries. I hope Walker keeps his LT job and Morgan can be used like Jenkins, just about anywhere.

What I'd really like is a consistent starting O line. This is certainly ideal as injuries have a big say. I think Love can do a lot of damage with the right protection, and Jacobs and Lloyd or whoever can put up some big numbers with solid blocking. I think the personnel are in place now to make this happen.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I've said that a number of times, too, but most people seem really locked in on how poorly he played at times earlier in the year. Truth is, there were quite a lot of weak spots on the line at some point or another early in the` season, and I didn't see where Myers was significantly worse than others. By the end of the year, Myers was very strong on pass defense - I read that on 54 postseason passing snaps, he gave up zero sacks, zero hurries.

It's his run blocking that worries me. Too many times, when he gets out into space, he doesn't seem to know what to do next. To be honest, sometimes it looks like he's afraid to pick a man until he knows for sure whether Ryan is going to miss his block, so maybe better guard play would make a difference. But he finished the year strong, and I think he gets a solid chance to win the job convincingly this summer. He'll have all the competition he needs to motivate him.

Good points. It's not like Myers is an awful C. We were spoiled for years with guys like Winters and Linsley. An upgrade is needed at C, but the O line will be fine if Myers stays put. And yeah, his biggest weakness is run blocking, and even that isn't enough to bench him. As you note, there will be more competition this year, a good thing.

 

[PikeBadger]

I've said that a number of times, too, but most people seem really locked in on how poorly he played at times earlier in the year. Truth is, there were quite a lot of weak spots on the line at some point or another early in the` season, and I didn't see where Myers was significantly worse than others. By the end of the year, Myers was very strong on pass defense - I read that on 54 postseason passing snaps, he gave up zero sacks, zero hurries.

It's his run blocking that worries me. Too many times, when he gets out into space, he doesn't seem to know what to do next. To be honest, sometimes it looks like he's afraid to pick a man until he knows for sure whether Ryan is going to miss his block, so maybe better guard play would make a difference. But he finished the year strong, and I think he gets a solid chance to win the job convincingly this summer. He'll have all the competition he needs to motivate him.

Agree, and most notably imo, is that Jenkins has gotten a pass from posters here for his very mediocre play last year. Yes, I know he was coming back from major injury but it doesn't change the fact that he didn't play well last year, especially in the first half of the season when penalties were derailing drives. He was contributing to those derailed drives often times.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Agree, and most notably imo, is that Jenkins has gotten a pass from posters here for his very mediocre play last year. Yes, I know he was coming back from major injury but it doesn't change the fact that he didn't play well last year, especially in the first half of the season when penalties were derailing drives. He was contributing to those derailed drives often times.

I didn't really notice this (drop-off in Jenkins' play) but yeah, his name didn';t come up much during broadcasts, at least not as much as his first few years.

Hopefully that was due to coming back from a significant injury.

 

[Krabs]

I fail to have your sense of optimism on the Monk pick. Most of the time when a GM reaches for a pick and Monk was a projected late 7th round pick, it doesn't work out. The odds are against the Monk pick working out. Maybe he'll be good enough to be a serviceable backup. The Packets will be fine at o line if everyone stays healthy. It's the depth that concerns me and capacity for the inevitable injuries to derail the unit.

Yeah, I was seeing 6th and 7th round on him after we took him. When I did the research on him I decided I loved the pick. The guy has a ton of experience and was 3 time all ACC. This doesn't happen by accident. He has proven that he is durable and available. The guy started over 50 games in college. The guy is athletic too with a RAS of 9.73 and he had the fasted 10 yard split of all offensive lineman in the combine. He also has played all the positions across the line. Shows his versatility. I don't think this guy is a project. I think he will push for playing time right away. Shows I'm itching for football to start if I'm this excited about an offensive lineman taken in the 5th round.

 

[OldSchool101]

Comparing Hopper to the Kraft pick helps me better understand the choice. Certainly Gluten and his team know a lot more about these guys than we do.

I wasn't crazy about the Kraft pick and was happy to be wrong. So I'll look forward to seeing Hopper get some snaps. And you're right, the Packers were in the same position at LB this year as they were at TE last year. TE worked out well so here's to more success.

Thanks @Heyjoe4. Last draft I took Kraft in Round 3 but it was more I thought he was our type. I really thought he’d get selected in that top 70 area. When we picked him for me it felt like our “safest” pick. He was a man among boys in FCS (and HS). Only ? Was would he adapt at this speed. He answered that ? Pretty quickly and decisively though. He didn’t look like a Rookie either.

What’s I’ve been reading or watching in review is that many of these selections are either highly versatile or have an exceptionally defined role. If and I mean IF they use Hopper to his strengths? I think he’s an average starting LB by his Sophomore campaign. His bottom is McDuffie imo

The other trait we went after were leaders or guys that overcame inspiring obstacles. High character and exceptional level desire and discipline. I think I also saw like 5 of these 10 players were team Captains ant shared that role in some capacity. The other played QB.

It’s not odd to say Hopper was even a 5th (not you) but he’s a very teachable player that inspires his teammate. Being a servant to others is a key to success. I’ll never forget the story about Lombardi struggling as a HC early on for us. He then went to his best players and pulled a King Solomon. He asked them for their opinion (using Advisors) of what was working and not working? Once they felt Vince’s desire to go to any length (including lowering oneself to their level to be taught) to win? The Packers dominated the rest of the season and the rest is history. I never knew this until I watched old player interviews.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Yeah, I was seeing 6th and 7th round on him after we took him. When I did the research on him I decided I loved the pick. The guy has a ton of experience and was 3 time all ACC. This doesn't happen by accident. He has proven that he is durable and available. The guy started over 50 games in college. The guy is athletic too with a RAS of 9.73 and he had the fasted 10 yard split of all offensive lineman in the combine. He also has played all the positions across the line. Shows his versatility. I don't think this guy is a project. I think he will push for playing time right away. Shows I'm itching for football to start if I'm this excited about an offensive lineman taken in the 5th round.

Those are some interesting stats on Monk. Not every player collects 50 starts in the ACC. Same with Morgan and his 37 starts at Arizona. And why take a risk a guy like Mims (8 starts) when durability and production win the day on an O line? Mims might flop at the next level. Seems unlikely that this would befall Morgan, or Monk.

That was a very unexciting draft class, and that probably says more about how good this team already was. The big holes were on D, and those were mostly filled with the best available in a weak class. Just for excitement, I'm looking for Lloyd to quickly ascend to the #2 RB.

 

[OldSchool101]

Just for excitement, I'm looking for Lloyd to quickly ascend to the #2 RB.

Luckily for Dillon he took a minimal offer. That probably solidified his place on our team. Had he been a $5m savings he’s probably gone. Smart move imo for a RB who, if he bounces back in 2024, will get a bigger 3rd contract somewhere.

It’ll be fun having another capable RB. If he pans out to expectation? We now have a pretty deep RB room