A few things to watch vs San Francisco

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'm all about hang time and no returns, but when that involves punting the ball less then 40 yards on your side of your own 40), that really doesn't equate to much value IMO. This seems to be the way Masthay punts. Or he gets his longest punts from 60 yards and in and they sail into or out of the endzone.

I'm not at practices, but it sounds like neither punters are impressing coaches so far. But if you look at preseason stats, yeah I know....kind of meaningless....Mortell seems to have the better numbers thus far.

Mortell: 5 punts 49.2 Ave. and a 48.8 Net Ave. Long: 61
Masthay: 6 punts 42.7 Ave. and a 26.7 Net Ave. Long: 51

It's worth noting that 4 out of 5 of Mortell's punts have been inside the 20. Masthay only 1

Hard to fault Masthay on the Net Ave. if that takes the block into account, since the block wasn't really his fault. But I'm confused on the stats if that was taken into account or not, since he has given up quite a few return yards on punts (49) and Mortell has only had 2 punts returned for 2 yards.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst...ategory=PUNTER&d-447263-s=PUNTING_NET_AVERAGE

I guess the next two games could give one player the job, but at this point I think we know what Masthay is (isn't) capable of and I would almost rather take my chances on a young eager punter that is hungry to play in the NFL, especially in GB. Mortell would also be the cheaper option by close to $600,000 less.


EDIT: I think this message board helps to tell me if a blocked punt figures into the averages. Thanks Pats Fans

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/scoring-a-blocked-punt.70989/

 

[Arthur Squires]

Wonder who gets more targets from Rodgers between Adams and Abby?

 

[Packerlifer]

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sp.../08/25/packers-49ers-5-things-watch/89345120/

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I'm all about hang time and no returns, but when that involves punting the ball less then 40 yards on your side of your own 40), that really doesn't equate to much value IMO. This seems to be the way Masthay punts. Or he gets his longest punts from 60 yards and in and they sail into or out of the endzone.

I'm not at practices, but it sounds like neither punters are impressing coaches so far. But if you look at preseason stats, yeah I know....kind of meaningless....Mortell seems to have the better numbers thus far.

Mortell: 5 punts 49.2 Ave. and a 48.8 Net Ave. Long: 61
Masthay: 6 punts 42.7 Ave. and a 26.7 Net Ave. Long: 51

It's worth noting that 4 out of 5 of Mortell's punts have been inside the 20. Masthay only 1

Hard to fault Masthay on the Net Ave. if that takes the block into account, since the block wasn't really his fault. But I'm confused on the stats if that was taken into account or not, since he has given up quite a few return yards on punts (49) and Mortell has only had 2 punts returned for 2 yards.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst...ategory=PUNTER&d-447263-s=PUNTING_NET_AVERAGE

I guess the next two games could give one player the job, but at this point I think we know what Masthay is (isn't) capable of and I would almost rather take my chances on a young eager punter that is hungry to play in the NFL, especially in GB. Mortell would also be the cheaper option by close to $600,000 less.


EDIT: I think this message board helps to tell me if a blocked punt figures into the averages. Thanks Pats Fans

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/scoring-a-blocked-punt.70989/

There's no denying Mortell has been the better punter during the preseason games so far but according to several reports he has struggled during training camp practices. It will for sure be interesting to follow what happens over the next two games and who the front office will keep at the position.

FYI here's the correct way a blocked punt is scored by the official NFL statistics guidelines:

A blocked punt is scored only when the punted ball does not go beyond the line of scrimmage. A “partially blocked” punt that travels beyond the line of scrimmage is not a blocked punt. A blocked punt is charged as a punt to the team, but not to the individual punter.

That means the league doesn't include the blocked punt against the Raiders into Masthay's individual stats.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

That means the league doesn't include the blocked punt against the Raiders into Masthay's individual stats.

Thanks Captain.

That was my conclusion as well after sifting through that trainwreck on the Pat Fans Message board. I did find the one poster (Tunescribe) on the message board quite comical when he said "This still does not make sense to me, and I used to do football stats as a sportswriter. There is no such thing as a "team" punting attempt in my book...That's a bogus category if you ask me"

So that being confirmed (Masthay's net average doesn't include the block), his 26.7 yard average is horrendous and currently ranks him 40th out of the 40 punters listed as kicking in preseason. Meanwhile, Mortell's 48.8 ave. has him ranked second. Yes, only 5-6 punts for each to go off of, but if the wide separation between Mortell's and Masthay's net average continues through the final 2 preseason games, I don't care what is going on in practice, Masthay should be gone.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

So that being confirmed (Masthay's net average doesn't include the block), his 26.7 yard average is horrendous and currently ranks him 40th out of the 40 punters listed as kicking in preseason. Meanwhile, Mortell's 48.8 ave. has him ranked second. Yes, only 5-6 punts for each to go off of, but if the wide separation between Mortell's and Masthay's net average continues through the final 2 preseason games, I don't care what is going on in practice, Masthay should be gone.

While the league for some reason included Masthay's block punt in his net average (but not the gross one) that number is actually at 31.2 yards, still way behind Mortell's.

I agree that as long as the stats look close to the same at the end of the preseason the Packers should retain the rookie.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

While the league for some reason included Masthay's block punt in his net average (but not the gross one) that number is actually at 31.2 yards, still way behind Mortell's.

I agree that as long as the stats look close to the same at the end of the preseason the Packers should retain the rookie.

That was my initial confusion with the rule, since the numbers in that stat chart just didn't add up if you don't count it.

Bottom line for me, despite Masthay setting a franchise record in net punting yards last year (14th in NFL), which does reflect good hang time, but IMO was more of a reflection of some stellar play by Janis and the rest of the special teams, he was terrible with the more important stats that solely measure his performance. That being touchbacks (6 of 81, ranking him 23rd), kicks inside the 20 (18 in 81, ranking him 31st) and gross ave. (43.9, ranking him 25th).

Ted will have to fight his 2 demons.....saving money ($600K) VS. retaining a vet. Should be interesting.

 

[HardRightEdge]

In my opinion Lacy doesn't look any slimmer than last season and therefore I doubt he's in better shape.

I agree he does not look much smaller, maybe 10 lbs.. He does look quicker, though. Swapping beer weight for healthier weight would have made a difference.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Bottom line for me, despite Masthay setting a franchise record in net punting yards last year (14th in NFL), which does reflect good hang time, but IMO was more of a reflection of some stellar play by Janis and the rest of the special teams, he was terrible with the more important stats that solely measure his performance. That being touchbacks (6 of 81, ranking him 23rd), kicks inside the 20 (18 in 81, ranking him 31st) and gross ave. (43.9, ranking him 25th).

The total amount of touchbacks and kicks inside the 20 isn't a great way to measure the performance by a punter. I prefer to take a look at the ratio of punts inside the 20 to touchbacks where the Packers ranked tied for 29th in the league last season. In addition field position should be considered as well but that would take too much time to analyze to figure out Masthay struggled in 2015.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I was going to say we need to see Clark do something. Anything. But I see he's questionable with a back issue.

Ryan's questionable. His play would be of interest, but it would appear he'll get few if any snaps.

Spriggs' pass blocking and Martinez being able to tackle somebody in the hole continue to be of interest.

With Clark and Daniels both questionable, we should get a good look at the guys contending for the D-Line roster spots. With Pennel heading to suspension, there's Guion, Daniels, Clark, ?, ?.

 

[PikeBadger]

I was going to say we need to see Clark do something. Anything. But I see he's questionable with a back issue.

Ryan's questionable. His play would be of interest, but it would appear he'll get few if any snaps.

Spriggs' pass blocking and Martinez being able to tackle somebody in the hole continue to be of interest.

With Clark and Daniels both questionable, we should get a good look at the guys contending for the D-Line roster spots. With Pennel heading to suspension, there's Guion, Daniels, Clark, ?, ?.

I'm looking forward to seeing how Ringo, Anderson, Price and Kuder play.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I'm looking forward to seeing how Ringo, Anderson, Price and Kuder play.

I want to see improvement out of Lowry as well.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

With Clark and Daniels both questionable, we should get a good look at the guys contending for the D-Line roster spots. With Pennel heading to suspension, there's Guion, Daniels, Clark, ?, ?.

Silverstein brought up the idea of moving Peppers or Datone at least part time to defensive end as long as Pennel is suspended. While that isn't ideal against the run it might work out better than playing Clark or Lowry opposite of Daniels.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Silverstein brought up the idea of moving Peppers or Datone at least part time to defensive end as long as Pennel is suspended. While that is ideal against the run it might work out better than playing Clark or Lowry opposite of Daniels.

In base defense? I think that's a stretch other than a here-or-there spot snap. In nickel, I would expect Peppers to get some snaps at 3-tech at some point with or without Pennel as we've seen in the past. Perhaps Jones as well, but that's somewhat doubtful given Capers proclamation last year that Jones needs to play against OTs. Lack of other option due to injury or performance issues could change that. I don't see Jones as a base DE at all. They tried to board that train but it left the station.

Peppers came to Green Bay with the promise of playing OLB to elongate his career. And he wants to continue playing after this season. I don't think he'd be too keen about mixing it up inside on regular basis. Maybe one or two games in rotation...against Minnesota.

In the past Peppers has on occasion put his hand in the dirt from the 9-tech spot in elephantine fashion as a quasi-DE in a hybrid front. Seeing that again would not be a revelation.

In base, they need to get Clark off the nose and in the 5-gap to see what he can do there. He's getting pushed around at the nose on both single and double teams against second stringers. I'd like to get a look at him as a gap player, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I want to see improvement out of Lowry as well.

He looks awfully gangly to me. I'm not sure he'll see much work this year except in obvious passing situation rotation. Those were Elliott's snaps. With Matthews back on the edge and Jones moving to OLB, there will be even less opportunity than Elliott's 17% snap count last season.

 

[yooperpackfan]

I'll be at our camp on Fish Lake sitting by the fire with a cold beer in my hand and my trusty hunting dog, Troy, by my side listening to it on the radio.
It doesn't get any better than that!

 

[Deleted member 6794]

In base defense? I think that's a stretch other than a here-or-there spot snap.

Of course I wanted to say that moving Peppers or Datone to defensive end in the base defense is NOT ideal against the run but it might be better than playing Clark or Lowry.

 

[HardRightEdge]

A thought on something we won't get to see. There was camp chatter about Burnett playing box safety/ILB hybrid. He's sitting out again this week. Maybe next week.

 

[JBlood]

Sherman

Horrible GM but decent coach other than caving in to Favres training nonroutine

 

[Half Empty]

Problem solved - the official packers.com What to Watch - http://www.packers.com/news-and-eve...to-watch/29bf4d75-9937-4ca5-ba17-0b8724ffb42d

 

[NelsonsLongCatch]

The only thing I'm really looking for in this game is all Packers leaving the game with two, intact ACLs!

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The only thing I'm really looking for in this game is all Packers leaving the game with two, intact ACLs!

Add hamstrings to that list!

 

[Carl]

I'm all about hang time and no returns, but when that involves punting the ball less then 40 yards on your side of your own 40), that really doesn't equate to much value IMO. This seems to be the way Masthay punts. Or he gets his longest punts from 60 yards and in and they sail into or out of the endzone.

I'm not at practices, but it sounds like neither punters are impressing coaches so far. But if you look at preseason stats, yeah I know....kind of meaningless....Mortell seems to have the better numbers thus far.

Mortell: 5 punts 49.2 Ave. and a 48.8 Net Ave. Long: 61
Masthay: 6 punts 42.7 Ave. and a 26.7 Net Ave. Long: 51

It's worth noting that 4 out of 5 of Mortell's punts have been inside the 20. Masthay only 1

Hard to fault Masthay on the Net Ave. if that takes the block into account, since the block wasn't really his fault. But I'm confused on the stats if that was taken into account or not, since he has given up quite a few return yards on punts (49) and Mortell has only had 2 punts returned for 2 yards.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst...ategory=PUNTER&d-447263-s=PUNTING_NET_AVERAGE

I guess the next two games could give one player the job, but at this point I think we know what Masthay is (isn't) capable of and I would almost rather take my chances on a young eager punter that is hungry to play in the NFL, especially in GB. Mortell would also be the cheaper option by close to $600,000 less.


EDIT: I think this message board helps to tell me if a blocked punt figures into the averages. Thanks Pats Fans

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/threads/scoring-a-blocked-punt.70989/

In game 1, Masthay did have a perfect high punt that was about to land at the 1, but Rollins last track of where he was and caught it straddling the goal line.

That hurts his numbers too.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

In game 1, Masthay did have a perfect high punt that was about to land at the 1, but Rollins last track of where he was and caught it straddling the goal line.

That hurts his numbers too.

Agreed, those are the things that stats don't show and us fans and coaches evaluating talent have to make note of. I've been pretty critical of Masthay over the last year plus and most of that criticism stems not from his bottom line stats, but his inconsistent punting over the past 2 seasons. Shanking kicks when he has the whole field to kick long and kicking long when he has a short field and should be going for a sideline. Would we see the same or even worse from Mortell? Quite possibly, but we could also see an improvement over the last 2 years of Masthay and his inconsistent ways that don't appear to have changed and at half the price. Unless things change a lot over the next 2 games, I'm ready for a change at what appears to be the only starting position that is still up for grabs.

 

[Arthur Squires]

I'm looking forward to seeing how Ringo, Anderson, Price and Kuder play.

Also want to see Lowry performs. I don't believe he is injured. A shame we don't see Clark tonight. We may start vs Jaguars with Guion at NT and Lowry at 5 Tech if he doesn't show some anchor skills.