Clay Matthews v TJ Watt v Kevin King

[Ogsponge]

So I may get blasted for this and people may wonder what is the point. I guess the point is to find out if I should eat crow at the end of the season, if it ends up a wash or I get to childishly say I told you so. Below are some quotes I had with the 1st group being before the draft and free agency. I have always been vocal about the fact that not drafting watt was idiotic. But that has to be taken in context with the quotes below as I don't believe Clay should be on this team and we should have used the money save on his ridiculously unworthy contract to get a CB in free agency. So below the quotes I will post weekly stats of the 3 players in question with possibly some thoughts.

Does anyone know a site where you can get more advanced stats such as passes defined, snap counts, etc... without having to pay for it?

#2.5. Clay must restructure or send him packing, he is not worth 15 million and we would be better off with the 4mil dead money hit and saving 11 million than keeping him on the roster.

#3. TT absolutely must get off his ***, swallow his pride, understand his way is not working (for getting another super bowl) and go out and spend money on one of the top free agent cb's. Period end of story.

#4. Draft TJ Watt if available at the 29th pick, this should be done even if he has to move up a few spots as he will be gone before we pick in the 2nd. Before anyone jumps on me, if you watched Wisconsin football at all you will know I am not saying this because of his name. 60 some tackles last year, 15.5 for loss, 11.5 sacks (lead the B10), 2 forced fumbles with one returned for a touchdown, plays with a relentless motor which is the one trait he does share with his brother. He is a beast and will be so in the NFL as well, not JJ level of beastlyness but a beast none the less.

Oh, and like I said in my thread from 2 or 3 months ago with this exact thread title, keeping clay on this team was the biggest mistake off the offseason, he should have been cut to use the money to sign a veteran cb better than house and then draft watt who will have twice as many sacks this year as clay for about 80% less money. I will however stipulate that could very well mean watt only has 2 sacks this year...

Week 1:

Clay: 2 tkls

As another poster pointed out, clay played well even though the stat line may not show that.

TJ: 5 tkls, 2 sacks, 1 int

King: nothing - which honestly is good for a cb.

The stats pretty much say all that is needed to be said but after 1 week the stats don't really mean all that much.

 

[thisisnate]

1 week is nothing to go on. TJ probably wouldn't have seen the field that much for us either. Heck of a start for him though.

 

[GleefulGary]

1) Which CB are we signing if we cut Clay? Pick one. You don't get to just say "sigh one."

2) Clay Matthews made an impact last night, and I don't know how you missed it. Don't just rely on box scores. He filled his gap well, he create different pressure which equals disruption. Is he worth his contract? Nah. But saying he didn't do anything bc limited stats is an absolutely awful, and ignorant explanation.

3) I didn't watch Watt play, so I won't comment on him. Good stat line, but I don't know how it happened.

4) King will be just fine. Threads like this always happen after a week, and they always get bumped at the end of the season while we laugh at awful predictions. Just be patient on your takes.

5) If King has a pick next week and Watt has zeros, will you be here for another thread?

 

[C-Lee]

It's one game......

 

[PackAttack12]

As soon as I seen TJ Watt's interception yesterday, I immediately posted in the shoutbox something along the lines of "man here we go".

Too predictable.

The stats pretty much say all that is needed to be said but after 1 week the stats don't really mean all that much.

The stats say everything you need to say, and then you discredit your own argument by saying they don't mean much.

Woooo weeee.

 

[Ogsponge]

1 week is nothing to go on. TJ probably wouldn't have seen the field that much for us either. Heck of a start for him though.

in my scenario he would have been a week one starter because clay would not be on the team.

 

[thequick12]

I think TT should have taken TJ Watt when he had the chance regardless of clay Matthews. Personally I'd have preferrered to have both cuz you can never have enough pass rushers and watt and Matthews can play inside. But either way TT decided he's rather have Vince biegel and Kevin king than tj watt alone. So really your comparison is biegel/king vs tj watt. King barely played but did knock a reciever out of bounds on a deep pass. Well see what biegel does but it seems watt is destined to follow in his brothers footsteps which seemed pretty obvious due to his work ethic and obsession for the game combined with elite athletic tools.

 

[GleefulGary]

in my scenario he would have been a week one starter because clay would not be on the team.

What FA CB are you signing with Clay's contract money?

Until you answer that, this is all irrelevant posturing.

And please only pick one

 

[GleefulGary]

And not to discount Watt, but he was playing against a rookie QB starting his first game, who isn't exactly known for having great awareness. His pick came on an awful, awful throw. He stepped himself into a couple sacks.

Watch the tape, don't rely on box scores.

 

[thequick12]

Doesn't really matter at some point if he keeps stepping into sacks they keep counting the same

 

[Ogsponge]

1) Which CB are we signing if we cut Clay? Pick one. You don't get to just say "sigh one."

2) Clay Matthews made an impact last night, and I don't know how you missed it. Don't just rely on box scores. He filled his gap well, he create different pressure which equals disruption. Is he worth his contract? Nah. But saying he didn't do anything bc limited stats is an absolutely awful, and ignorant explanation.

3) I didn't watch Watt play, so I won't comment on him. Good stat line, but I don't know how it happened.

4) King will be just fine. Threads like this always happen after a week, and they always get bumped at the end of the season while we laugh at awful predictions. Just be patient on your takes.

5) If King has a pick next week and Watt has zeros, will you be here for another thread?

1. Fine I will pick Gilmore who had a bad game week 1

2. I never said he didn't make an impact. Why so combative?

4. I never said he wouldn't be fine.

5. Yes, I will be here every single week even if I have to eat crow every single week. Which by the way I already said, again, why so combative?

 

[GleefulGary]

Doesn't really matter at some point if he keeps stepping into sacks they keep counting the same

It makes a difference when trying to determine the quality of a player.

Josh McCown threw 39 times and completed 68% of his passes. Should we be impressed by that? How you accumulate your stats matters when quantifying whether one player is better than another.

 

[PackAttack12]

5. Yes, I will be here every single week even if I have to eat crow every single week. Which by the way I already said, again, why so combative?

Most all newbies come in the first few weeks with the boxing gloves on.

 

[Ogsponge]

It's one game......

Which is why I said one game worth of stats does not mean much and I also said I will be back every week, even if it is to eat crow.

 

[Ogsponge]

As soon as I seen TJ Watt's interception yesterday, I immediately posted in the shoutbox something along the lines of "man here we go".

Too predictable.

The stats say everything you need to say, and then you discredit your own argument by saying they don't mean much.

Woooo weeee.

Yet again reference my quotes that go back before the draft an FA, I am not doing this because Watt had one good game, I will be here every week even if I end up looking like a fool.

 

[kevans74]

Honestly the Seahawks don't have what I would call a "scary" receiving corp besides Jimmy Graham.

Daniels, HaHa, Burnett all looked fantastic but those guys were already our studs of our defense lol.

What I was more impressed with was the outside corners, at least by "limiting" Wilson and their guys.
House looked like a smart bandaid and Randall looked much improved with some good plays
If King can continue to grow we should have a stud secondary on the outsides too

 

[Ogsponge]

And not to discount Watt, but he was playing against a rookie QB starting his first game, who isn't exactly known for having great awareness. His pick came on an awful, awful throw. He stepped himself into a couple sacks.

Watch the tape, don't rely on box scores.

This is the NFL, that stat line is good against anyone.

 

[ExpatPacker]

Kevin King is probably going to worked into the starting lineup slowly. Let's see what's going by week 8 and then compare.

 

[Dantés]

1. Coming in to crow about how you liked a guy that half of Packer fans were in love with, myself included, is bush league. Be better than that.

2. We need at least two seasons.

3. We will always have to compare the value of Watt against that of both King AND Biegel, because that's what they got when they passed on Watt to trade down.

 

[GleefulGary]

Most all newbies come in the first few weeks with the boxing gloves on.

This is me on my best behavior.

 

[Dantés]

This is me on my best behavior.

Get in there and get your hands dirty, rookie.

 

[Candidate for Deletion]

lol at all of the "gosh golly, its only one game, don't over-react" posts. Did any of those read the primary comment, where he said that this would be a weekly look to track the progress of each and that OP was willing to use it as evidence against himself for purposes of crow eating?

 

[GleefulGary]

Get in there and get your hands dirty, rookie.

I'm your huckleberry.

 

[mongoosev]

onto game two. lets see how well clay does against a better O line.

 

[Ogsponge]

1. Coming in to crow about how you liked a guy that half of Packer fans were in love with, myself included, is bush league. Be better than that.

2. We need at least two seasons.

3. We will always have to compare the value of Watt against that of both King AND Biegel, because that's what they got when they passed on Watt to trade down.

You should reread my post if you think I am crowing. Not understanding what someone clearly stated then calling them bush league is bush league. Be better than that.